Stupid modelling questions
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Stupid modelling questions
1. What size should ships be (modelling in Wings3d)?
More accurately - what's the scale used? What does one unit in Wings3d equate to in game world terms?
2. Are any of the original models available in .wings format? I'd really like to retexture (and remap uv coords) some of the original stations.
More accurately - what's the scale used? What does one unit in Wings3d equate to in game world terms?
2. Are any of the original models available in .wings format? I'd really like to retexture (and remap uv coords) some of the original stations.
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well, i can't tell really.
though you COULD just snap them to a size of a power of 10, and then easilly scale them in the .xunit file
like so:
<in the model, the ship is size 10 units nose to tail>
then
you want it 35 units long
<in the .xunit file set scale to 3.5>
this way you can later adjust the size without a calculator.
by that i mean if you made the model 37.2 units long and you wanted it to be 29.8 units long, you'd have to rescale it in wings, or do some long division and put in your result as your scale.
-scheherazade
though you COULD just snap them to a size of a power of 10, and then easilly scale them in the .xunit file
like so:
<in the model, the ship is size 10 units nose to tail>
then
you want it 35 units long
<in the .xunit file set scale to 3.5>
this way you can later adjust the size without a calculator.
by that i mean if you made the model 37.2 units long and you wanted it to be 29.8 units long, you'd have to rescale it in wings, or do some long division and put in your result as your scale.
-scheherazade
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Yeah, that's a little problem.
But maybe somebody can make a model-compare mission/system where you add your models you want to compare in the file and they are there close to each other (not moving , like stations)
But i don't know if this is possible with mission/system files.
Does anybody know how to do this?
Pontiac
But maybe somebody can make a model-compare mission/system where you add your models you want to compare in the file and they are there close to each other (not moving , like stations)
But i don't know if this is possible with mission/system files.
Does anybody know how to do this?
Pontiac
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Okay, I had an eyeball at the files, how does this sound?
The wayfarer has a bounding box for its hull and wings approximately 62 x 14 x 42 (|x| |y| |z|) units.
Putting a model ship I made next to it (a small scout shuttle intended to be 3m x 2m x 6m taking one unit in Wings3d to equal one meter) - I think I need to scale my model up by a factor of three to make it look right next to the wayfarer.
That would make the wayfarer's size about 20m x 5m x 14m and a relay station (83 units |y| x120 unit scale = 9960 units) 3310m from top to tip.
Do those sizes seem right?
Putting a model ship I made next to it (a small scout shuttle intended to be 3m x 2m x 6m taking one unit in Wings3d to equal one meter) - I think I need to scale my model up by a factor of three to make it look right next to the wayfarer.
That would make the wayfarer's size about 20m x 5m x 14m and a relay station (83 units |y| x120 unit scale = 9960 units) 3310m from top to tip.
Do those sizes seem right?
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About them turrets, I've modelled a ship with 6 across the top and all of them are WAY too big... bigger then the ship even... now the problem is if I scale the ship, the guns will sink into the center of the ship (correct me if i'm wrong). Which leaves me with the alternative of rescaling the ship in Wings...
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This should probably work...
Edit the unit file.
Add or change the <Unit scale="X"> tag at the start where X is the factor you're scaling up by, then find the <subunit file="turret" ... > tag and edit it multiplying the x y and z coordinates by the same scale factor.
Add or change the <Unit scale="X"> tag at the start where X is the factor you're scaling up by, then find the <subunit file="turret" ... > tag and edit it multiplying the x y and z coordinates by the same scale factor.
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if you want to know hte scale as in
units per metre, then you gotta ask hellcat
though this is something i've always been nagging him to make solid
i think he said 1u:1m, but it doesn't feel that way... i donno.
we need a solid unit scale definition. and we need to enforce it.
unit scale should be one of the primary things in any game. it usually is critical. and i'm really surprised at how little it is documented and enforced. i've never seen this kind of lax scaling ever before...
-scheherazade
units per metre, then you gotta ask hellcat
though this is something i've always been nagging him to make solid
i think he said 1u:1m, but it doesn't feel that way... i donno.
we need a solid unit scale definition. and we need to enforce it.
unit scale should be one of the primary things in any game. it usually is critical. and i'm really surprised at how little it is documented and enforced. i've never seen this kind of lax scaling ever before...
-scheherazade
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Re: This should probably work...
Are you sure about this?aegidian wrote:Edit the unit file.
Add or change the <Unit scale="X"> tag at the start where X is the factor you're scaling up by, then find the <subunit file="turret" ... > tag and edit it multiplying the x y and z coordinates by the same scale factor.
The unit-scale don't scale the turret positions?
I didn't test any turrets ingame (just the source), so i don't know
Pontiac
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yeah...VS is a bit odd with the way it handles units....I think it's because of all those random scale variables in the config fileAnonymous wrote:if you want to know hte scale as in
units per metre, then you gotta ask hellcat
though this is something i've always been nagging him to make solid
i think he said 1u:1m, but it doesn't feel that way... i donno.
we need a solid unit scale definition. and we need to enforce it.
unit scale should be one of the primary things in any game. it usually is critical. and i'm really surprised at how little it is documented and enforced. i've never seen this kind of lax scaling ever before...
-scheherazade
not much we can do about that unless we want to rebuild half the data (systems etc) with a uniform scale...:-/
Dan.a
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The systems aren't a problem - everything looks tiny next to a planet even if they aren't 'real planet sizes'.
But a merchant capable of carrying 2000 cargo SHOULD look bigger than a hunter with virtually no cargo space and carrying fewer weapons. Plus there's the whole 'fitting intpo the docking bays' issue.
The ships *should* get re-scaled (no need to remodel).
I have an idea this could be done quite easily, gimme a week and then I'll see if I haven't found a solution that'll impress.
But a merchant capable of carrying 2000 cargo SHOULD look bigger than a hunter with virtually no cargo space and carrying fewer weapons. Plus there's the whole 'fitting intpo the docking bays' issue.
The ships *should* get re-scaled (no need to remodel).
I have an idea this could be done quite easily, gimme a week and then I'll see if I haven't found a solution that'll impress.
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if all the ships were normalized to X units, then you could use a multiplier in the config really ez.
this should be the practice.
weapons/upgrades : 1 unit
fighters : 10 units
cap ships : 100 units
bases : 1000 units
(note the difference comes from precision loss. if you have something with lotsa detail shrunk too much the points start to shift, so too much shrinkage is bad. you can't just shrink everything to 1 unit or whatever.)
and unit config files should be used to change scale via multiplier.
this way everyone knows what the scale is just by looking at the unit config file.
-scheherazade
this should be the practice.
weapons/upgrades : 1 unit
fighters : 10 units
cap ships : 100 units
bases : 1000 units
(note the difference comes from precision loss. if you have something with lotsa detail shrunk too much the points start to shift, so too much shrinkage is bad. you can't just shrink everything to 1 unit or whatever.)
and unit config files should be used to change scale via multiplier.
this way everyone knows what the scale is just by looking at the unit config file.
-scheherazade