You don't need a Quad core

[Greekgifted]

Did you know, a Quad core CPU isn't required to run a VS server?

I've seen some interest in multiplayer around here, but no one's actually doing anything. I got a server running 2 clients, a few computer ships, and around 5-10 systems simultaneously. This was with a Pentium III 550 MHz!

If you can get a Quad or Dual core running a server that's great, but what if it fails, for whatever reason? Then the whole universe is wiped out. But if a PIII can run even just 1 system with computer ships and stations, that's great! Because everyone with a spare PIII or something similar (or better) can set up a set up a system, so you multiply that original system by 5, if 5 people pitch in, or more or less depending on how many people can.

I would like to set up a public server, but unfortunately now is not a good time for me. But anyone else is welcome to!

[MC707]

I don't know much about VS servers nor their requirements, but if what you say is true, then I will wipe my dusty pentium III from xp, give it a linux, and start a server.

[Greekgifted]

Cool, the only real problems I've noticed is that there aren't any stations or outposts, and NPC's only pop up if you do a mission that makes them appear.
So once we figure out how to get battle stations and the like in, we'll be golden!

[MC707]

well I think the server engine must be overhauled too. First of all, there is a very poor system of server and client. For instance, clients needing a password generated by an engine which not even I understand is not very viable. Second, the server should come also as a standalone package, for server only purposes (my pentium III for example). Third, it is tremendously difficult to setup a server (of what I've experienced myself and what I've heard in the forums). Finally, 90% of games (that I know of, at least) use a system of a masterlist or masterserver, which queries all clients with information of all servers online. The latter should be the system we should use, for generic purposes and users sake.

Cool, the only real problems I've noticed is that there aren't any stations or outposts, and NPC's only pop up if you do a mission that makes them appear.
So once we figure out how to get battle stations and the like in, we'll be golden!

That should be also fixed, we must somehow reach a point to have at least some systems AND more importantly, NPCs.

[Greekgifted]

When I ran the server, that was all i was running (well, that and the httpserver). There's the vegaserver binary (the standalone server) and all the stuff in data/cgi-accountserver. If you want you can compile just the server.

As for difficulty setting it up, not so sure. Yes it took me months, but that was because I didn't properly read the somewhat confusing documentation in the wiki...

And I don't think we need a masterlist/masterserver. We want just 1 constantly changing/moving/evolving universe. What would the master list show? Which system you want to go to today? Maybe if we had several mods running alongside each other, that would be practical, but I dunno otherwise.

I'm not much of a coder, so I don't know what you mean by "poor system of server and client" but maybe that's related to the strange movements of stations and ships...

[MC707]

When I ran the server, that was all i was running (well, that and the httpserver). There's the vegaserver binary (the standalone server) and all the stuff in data/cgi-accountserver. If you want you can compile just the server.

people don't want to download the entire game for the server. correct me if I am wrong (really don't remember) but you need to do so to get the server. Thus, a simple precompiled server would be easier for everyone, just put a link in the downloads page of the website or something, keep it simple.

As for difficulty setting it up, not so sure. Yes it took me months, but that was because I didn't properly read the somewhat confusing documentation in the wiki...

and you think everyone is going to spend months of trial and error or hours of reading a confusing documentation? no. we have to make it user friendly, so you just download and make it work out of the box (or the closest to it). Most people won't even care about reading complex installation procedures.

And I don't think we need a masterlist/masterserver. We want just 1 constantly changing/moving/evolving universe. What would the master list show? Which system you want to go to today? Maybe if we had several mods running alongside each other, that would be practical, but I dunno otherwise.

oh and who is going to give us the 1 only server with 1 constantly changing/moving/evolving universe? that is not feasible. even if we only *made* 1 server, we wouldn't be able to withstand a demand that a mmorpg (or whatever you write that) server would need to supply for a single universe. I've read several threads (of which I do not remember the location,) that say that the strain would be too much. Even massive mmorpgs have several servers to cope with demand. Thus, not every player would connect from one single geographical place.

I'm not much of a coder, so I don't know what you mean by "poor system of server and clietn" but maybe that's related to the strange movements of stations and ships...

erm you don't need to be a coder to know that by a "poor system of server and clietn" I mean a poor multiplayer system which consists of a server which doesn't have a master server list for servers, as well as a poor client that requires a password made by an engine not even I understand. Do you think its practical to go get a password online just to enter a server? no. people just want to browse a list that has a good ping and a good map/gametype/#players/etc., though in this case only a good ping and a good # of players would be what they will be searching for.

You see, someone was even trying to get a server up and running some months ago IIRC. Dunno what happened, but there is a possibility they couldn't set it up for technical reasons or for another similar reason.

[Greekgifted]

True a binary should be available for just the server, what I meant though was that if you want to COMPILE the game, you don't have to compile everything, there's a thing in the configure script for just the server. So It shouldn't be hard to stick a binary up there on the download page.

When It came to documentation, I just overlooked a line saying run the httpserver, then run the vegaserver. I was trying to run the httpserver by itself, which was probably kind of stupid on my part. It actually is very simple and works almost out of the box with just a few changes to configuration files.

What I'm trying to get at here is that we want 1 universe, with many systems. To do this we need to use many servers. Say you have 5 servers, each running 1 system, each system being part of the same universe. I don't see how a masterlist can help us here. In a game where you pick up where you left off last, how would it make sense to just browse the list of servers that are running the game, pick one and go to it, when not all servers run the same universe. I probably wasn't clear though, I'm talking about an MMO here, not a set of deathmatch servers. For deathmatch I definitely agree you need a masterlist.

I also saw a few things with guys trying to set up a server. Don't know why they didn't manage to keep it going. The game is very playable in MMO mode, yes its missing a few things, but as far as I can tell on a LAN, those things aren't critical to the basic functionality. Who knows maybe over the internet will be different, but you never know till you try.

[MC707]

oh ok then. there is a problem with what you plan though. for instance, how would you connect to another server? going through a wormhole that connects you to another server? how do you interconnect these systems/servers? how do you know you are not going to connect to a server as laggy as hell? WHO is going to do all these things? have these questions as rethorical, as I don't want to compromise anybody or put responsibilities to any of the devs, so never mind I'll drop the matter (this thread is not about this anyway ).

to the point, I will make an effort to setup a server and test how it goes. If I set it up in my box, I'll try in my pentium III and confirm this.

[Greekgifted]

I think the server interconnection is already set up. I actually did connect 2 servers ( my pentium and my dual core laptop), connected from the laptop and the different systems reported as different servers (I'll have to check again to make sure I remember right). And yes, going through a wormhole takes you to another sytem and possibly another server.

So that's all there, if you have enough computers you can try it (the faster computer can run a server AND a client). Just read the readme in cgi-accountserver, should be pretty self explanatory.

[loki1950]

BTW www2 is the guy working on the cgi-accountsever so a PM to him might be productive and he is one of the advocates for MMO and is also trying to work out the needed infrastructure so all in all coordinating with him would be a good idea.

Enjoy the Choice

[MC707]

I see. I really would like helping with the multiplaya side of things, though I am curious as to what knowledge I would have to have (c++, python, etc.)