And now, for something completely different...

For collaboration between the different artists creating music and sound for vegastrike.
Turbo
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Re: And now, for something completely different...

Post by Turbo »

You may be right. I totally don't understand why people would want SPF in a space simulator, so I often forget that some people do want it, and as as result that did not occur to me. But I will start work on the audio for the news item and see if the reality matches my vision.
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Re: And now, for something completely different...

Post by CLoneWolf »

Heheh as I said, I was just kidding; please go on! :roll:
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Re: And now, for something completely different...

Post by Boaal »

"A shocking scene today as the vegastrike development blog was actually updated. Nothing has been heard or seen from this reclusive and mute entity for an extended amount of time, witnesses to it's sudden, unexpected arrival were taken to hospitals where they are being treated for shock. Attempts at attaining interviews from those that were party to it's appearance have met with little success, those not being treated for shock have gone insane and are raving incoherantly, or have taken to silence as they work through their awe".

"Reports of a deranged Aeran have surfaced not long ago. Allegedly the Aeran was given a large dose of steroids. As the drugs took hold, the ensuing 'roid-rage' drove it into a fit of mindless violence. The Aera, already known for being excessively aggressive, seem to react in worse ways than usual for a 'roid-rage' sufferer.

Witnesses watched as the alien accused a toaster of flirting with it, before stamping the offending appliance into the ground, and picking a fight with a Mule class trading ship owned by an up and coming merchant. Once it had tired of beating the space ship with a metal pipe, it charged off the attempt to stamp a hole in a suspended metal walk-way several hundred feet above ground level, which it found "too insulting to ignore".

It has since taken off in a Nicander and has been flying around in system, insulting and shooting at anything and everything that crosses it's radar. Until the drugs wear off, in system authorities advise you give this ship a wide berth."
The Twitching Pattern - http://www.last.fm/music/The+Twitching+Pattern
Have a listen.
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Re: And now, for something completely different...

Post by Psycodeine »

Boaal wrote:"A shocking scene today as the vegastrike development blog was actually updated. Nothing has been heard or seen from this reclusive and mute entity for an extended amount of time, witnesses to it's sudden, unexpected arrival were taken to hospitals where they are being treated for shock. Attempts at attaining interviews from those that were party to it's appearance have met with little success, those not being treated for shock have gone insane and are raving incoherantly, or have taken to silence as they work through their awe".

"Reports of a deranged Aeran have surfaced not long ago. Allegedly the Aeran was given a large dose of steroids. As the drugs took hold, the ensuing 'roid-rage' drove it into a fit of mindless violence. The Aera, already known for being excessively aggressive, seem to react in worse ways than usual for a 'roid-rage' sufferer.

Witnesses watched as the alien accused a toaster of flirting with it, before stamping the offending appliance into the ground, and picking a fight with a Mule class trading ship owned by an up and coming merchant. Once it had tired of beating the space ship with a metal pipe, it charged off the attempt to stamp a hole in a suspended metal walk-way several hundred feet above ground level, which it found "too insulting to ignore".

It has since taken off in a Nicander and has been flying around in system, insulting and shooting at anything and everything that crosses it's radar. Until the drugs wear off, in system authorities advise you give this ship a wide berth."
nice one for the devs!
--
Psycodeine / Code 57
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Re: And now, for something completely different...

Post by yuzienborn »

Boaal, that is 100% pure awesome :)
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Re: And now, for something completely different...

Post by Turbo »

Merry Christmas to all!

Here is the news story I suggested. Given that I had all the sound effects from the game and free sources, this only took an hour and fifteen minutes to mix. Enjoy:

http://www.willadsenfamily.org/VSvoice/ ... chhead.ogg

The script is at http://www.willadsenfamily.org/VSvoice/ ... chhead.txt

I would call this a draft, because this sound file has 3 voice tracks, a music track, 3 wind tracks, but only 4 weapon/explosion tracks (each separately built fom 2-3 tracks each).

The battle sounds are greatly simplified. The attackers are only using particle guns (faint weapons fire, loud hits and explosions) and the defenders ion cannons (loud weapons fire, faint explosions). Also to simplify matters, I did not delay the distant sounds to indicate distance, but that would be easy to do. So, do you think the battle is chaotic enough, or do we need more weaons, or more types of weapons, in the fight? Can you understand the reporter over the background noise?
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Re: And now, for something completely different...

Post by CLoneWolf »

Turbo wrote:Merry Christmas to all!
Merry XMas to you and the whole universe too!
Turbo wrote:Here is the news story I suggested. Given that I had all the sound effects from the game and free sources, this only took an hour and fifteen minutes to mix. Enjoy:
[...]
The battle sounds are greatly simplified. The attackers are only using particle guns (faint weapons fire, loud hits and explosions) and the defenders ion cannons (loud weapons fire, faint explosions). Also to simplify matters, I did not delay the distant sounds to indicate distance, but that would be easy to do. So, do you think the battle is chaotic enough, or do we need more weaons, or more types of weapons, in the fight? Can you understand the reporter over the background noise?
I like it a lot! The GNN news jingle is perfect for these live reports and gives continuity; as for understanding, mine gets lower with any disturbance but that's just me because of my non-native untrained ear :) So I think that it's well balanced between understandability and noise level due to reporting close to the battlefront, well done!
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Re: And now, for something completely different...

Post by Turbo »

CLoneWolf wrote:I like it a lot!
Thanks. Do you think we need to offset the distant sounds, to reflect how long it takes sound to travel in air? Sound goes at 350 m/s and most VS projectiles are much faster.
CLoneWolf wrote: as for understanding, mine gets lower with any disturbance but that's just me because of my non-native untrained ear :)
I can reduce the volume on the battle sounds behind him, just as we did with the alien language vs the translator voice. In addition to understanding the reporter and anchor, we don't want the player to think he is under attack.

My main concern is whether the battle is complex enough to be convincing. I have never been in combat, but I was in a company team live fire exercise years ago, firing real bullets with targets that did not shoot back. We had 10 tanks (1 big cannon and 2 kinds of machine gun each), 4 IFVs (1 small cannon and 1 machine gun each), 2 scout helicopters (1 machine gun and 1 rocket pod each), and heavy artillery (6 guns too far away to hear), all shooting at 20-40 targets at a time, 1-3 Km in front of us. That was a small one-way battle but the sound was very chaotic compared to the little fight in my news story.
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Re: And now, for something completely different...

Post by CLoneWolf »

Turbo wrote:Thanks. Do you think we need to offset the distant sounds, to reflect how long it takes sound to travel in air? Sound goes at 350 m/s and most VS projectiles are much faster.
It might be a refining touch of realism; if a remix of this is in order for any reason, and taking care of that aspect is not too much of a hassle, I'd say go for it, but I don't think many would pay so much attention to such a lack of detail (and be let down by it) while trying to understand the news in the chaos of the battle :)
Turbo wrote:I can reduce the volume on the battle sounds behind him, just as we did with the alien language vs the translator voice. In addition to understanding the reporter and anchor, we don't want the player to think he is under attack.
Oh, if the reporter is in a relatively safe place, we can assume they have the means to boost the voice for best understandability, while still keeping battle noises loud enough to report what it's like out there.
Turbo wrote:My main concern is whether the battle is complex enough to be convincing. I have never been in combat, but I was in a company team live fire exercise years ago, firing real bullets with targets that did not shoot back. We had 10 tanks (1 big cannon and 2 kinds of machine gun each), 4 IFVs (1 small cannon and 1 machine gun each), 2 scout helicopters (1 machine gun and 1 rocket pod each), and heavy artillery (6 guns too far away to hear), all shooting at 20-40 targets at a time, 1-3 Km in front of us. That was a small one-way battle but the sound was very chaotic compared to the little fight in my news story.
Even one-sided, that's one hell of variety of weapons and, don't forget that, vehicle engines (tanks, helis).
I see your concern, but the point is that future battles might require a narrower choice of weapons (one-shot-kills-all :mrgreen: ) so your battle sounds could be convincing as well, I have no idea at all... :roll:
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Re: And now, for something completely different...

Post by Turbo »

Timing changes are easy -- weapons and exposions are all separate tracks. Originally I did it to time the explosions to the weapons, so it would be easy to time shift the distant weapons and explosions. But, 3 Km is 8.5 seconds in an earth-like atmosphere, so I'll have to see how it sounds.

Likewise, it wouldn't take much to add more types of weapons. I'll experiment further.
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Re: And now, for something completely different...

Post by CLoneWolf »

By the time you hear Boom F due to Shot F, you've heard Booms A B C D E due to earlier Shots :)
As long as fire rate is faster than the sound delay, shot-boom couples will most prolly be (IMHO!) not discernable :)
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Re: And now, for something completely different...

Post by Turbo »

That is an excellent point -- the battle is ongoing so you won't be able to consciously match fire/hit pairs because some of it happened before the studio cut to the reporter's mike.

First, I time-shifted all the distant sound events. Then I added 2 small rapid-fire weapons and a missile launcher. Then, I used the stereo channels to shift the wind direction and to put weapons and explosions in different locations. Finally, I reduced the volume on all the battle sounds to make the reporter easier to hear. With headphones, you can hear the events happening to the left, right, and front of the reporter.

My one regret now is that I need to work on changing my voice more, the 3 voices sound too much alike. But here it is anyway:
http://www.willadsenfamily.org/VSvoice/ ... hhead2.ogg

This simple 1 minute 12 seconds of audio has 3 voice tracks, 1 music, 3 wind, 4 weapon, 1 impact, and 2 explosion tracks, but it matches my original idea so I'm happy.

Edit: This is an open source project so if someone wants to store the AUP file and script in the repository, then let me know and I'll make it available. It's 22 MB, zipped.
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Re: And now, for something completely different...

Post by CLoneWolf »

Turbo wrote:First, I time-shifted all the distant sound events. Then I added 2 small rapid-fire weapons and a missile launcher. Then, I used the stereo channels to shift the wind direction and to put weapons and explosions in different locations. Finally, I reduced the volume on all the battle sounds to make the reporter easier to hear. With headphones, you can hear the events happening to the left, right, and front of the reporter.
Great job, the wind, extra weapons and stereo panning variety improve the immersion feeling a lot!
Turbo wrote:My one regret now is that I need to work on changing my voice more, the 3 voices sound too much alike. But here it is anyway:
http://www.willadsenfamily.org/VSvoice/ ... hhead2.ogg
That's not a problem for a native speaker like you :) You have room to play with real accents from your whereabouts (or any other accent you can genuinely do without sounding like a parody as it'd happen if I tried :mrgreen: ), some pitch shifting in post-production, and even mimicking the ways different tv speakers would say the same sentence with their own metrics (like stressing keywords by slowing down, or stronger tones, or higher pitches...)

Post-production can also give you other options, like adding more reverb to the studio voice, while the live reporting voice stays bare... And let's not forget about the other voice acting member of your family! ;)
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Re: And now, for something completely different...

Post by Turbo »

Now that we have recorded and produced our first "news" audio clip, it got me to thinking more about how to put it into the game.

It seems fairly simple to add the news items as if they were songs, by adding them to the *.M3U playlists. But, there are playlists in the .vegastrike folder and also in the playlists folder under that. The latter seem to be specific to both situations and races, except that ISO is separate from terrans in the playlists.

Because news and entertainment broadcasts might be distracting when the player is in battle, I recommend we limit the news and entertainment items to "peace" situations. But, should we limit the entertainment broadcasts according to race/faction?

Some shows would have enough popularity to broadcast to neighboring systems or sectors (the 32d century version of X-band satellite radio), and only a few would be available in another races' territory. But unless we make hundreds of broadcasts (impractical both for production cost and download size), we will start repeating ourselves after a few hours of play.

I suggest we apply limits sparingly, i.e. make the news and entertainment available in all systems. Sometimes limits might be appropriate -- the Dizzy's Chicken contest, for example, might not make sense in a Rlaan system. Everything else we can play anywhere the player goes, assuming that a pilot could find at least one station of his preferred language, even if it was his own government's propaganda channel beamed into enemy space.

What do you think?
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Re: And now, for something completely different...

Post by CLoneWolf »

IMHO, boredom by repetitiveness is the worst show-stopper ever. Before we thought about introducing limits that make sense, we should have enough content to grant variety even if someone decides to stay in, say, Aera zones for a long time to buy all the adv torpedoes they can :)

Right now, I think it's time to add and expand, not to remove and limit :) May that time come soon, but it's not now ;)

Of course I agree on radio going off automatically when in danger, it will also add tension!

As for the Rlaan, they could put the Chicken in the Tupperware, if you didn't always forget to bring 'em some... ;)
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Re: And now, for something completely different...

Post by Turbo »

Fair enough. I'm mostly concerned with how to get the sound into the game, so I'll experiment and report back.

I just re-read this entire thread and, we have a huge number of ideas here. Not all of them are in the wiki yet, so I added some of the items we have been discussing. I'll work the rest in a few days.

Also, it occurs to me that since we have 2 sports items written, hopefully with more on the way, we could use some sports music. Every news agency I can think of has a kind of theme song for their sports anchor that is different than the main news music. I'm thinking something similar to battle5.ogg that is in the game now, but I don't want to use the actual battle song since we don't want the player to think he's under attack.

Edit: More info on the process is here: http://vegastrike.sourceforge.net/media ... nual:Music
I dropped gnn_beachhead.ogg into the music folder, then added it to the playlists. The lists in the playlists folder did not do anything, but when I added the file to the "peace" and "terran" lists in the .vegastrike folder, the news story played when I was in human space and at peace. I tried removing it from all playlists except "peace" and it still only played in terran space, possibly because my relationship with the Rlaan is close to neutral and my relationship to the Aera much lower. We could probably get it to play in Aera space (outside of battle) by adding it to the "Aera" playlist but, currently, there is no corresponding list for the Rlaan.
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Re: And now, for something completely different...

Post by CLoneWolf »

Turbo wrote:Also, it occurs to me that since we have 2 sports items written, hopefully with more on the way, we could use some sports music. Every news agency I can think of has a kind of theme song for their sports anchor that is different than the main news music. I'm thinking something similar to battle5.ogg that is in the game now, but I don't want to use the actual battle song since we don't want the player to think he's under attack.
battle5.ogg really tastes like "action news" jingle, it could serve as inspiration for a new appropriate one!
...ok this draft is nowhere near it, but I got carried away with orchestra hits... :roll:
http://olografix.org/groucho/vs/JingleDraft.ogg
I don't know if it fits the sports theme, maybe it's more a "breaking news" thing, for fate-changing news like cats stuck on trees and the like...
Turbo wrote:Edit: More info on the process is here: http://vegastrike.sourceforge.net/media ... nual:Music
I dropped gnn_beachhead.ogg into the music folder, then added it to the playlists. The lists in the playlists folder did not do anything, but when I added the file to the "peace" and "terran" lists in the .vegastrike folder, the news story played when I was in human space and at peace. I tried removing it from all playlists except "peace" and it still only played in terran space, possibly because my relationship with the Rlaan is close to neutral and my relationship to the Aera much lower. We could probably get it to play in Aera space (outside of battle) by adding it to the "Aera" playlist but, currently, there is no corresponding list for the Rlaan.
Cool, all of this confirms the ease of adding new content; as for the lack of situational/factional playlists, they must rely on some sort of default preset that must be specified somewhere else, if not hardcoded.
Look at what I just found by grepping m3u along the svn tree:

These seem to be the default playlists in vegastrike/src/cmd/music.cpp:

Code: Select all

  const char *deflistvars [MAXLIST]={"battle.m3u","peace.m3u","panic.m3u","victory.m3u","loss.m3u"};
This is even more interesting, in vegastrike/src/faction_util.cpp:

Code: Select all

void FactionUtil::LoadFactionPlaylists() {
  for (unsigned int i=0;i<factions.size();i++) {
        string fac=FactionUtil::GetFaction(i);
    fac+=".m3u";
    factions[i]->playlist= muzak->Addlist (fac.c_str());
  }
}
it seems that you're free to create a Rlaan.m3u playlist (actually the precise faction name to use is the one returned by GetFaction, it might be case sensitive) and it'll get automatically loaded.
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Re: And now, for something completely different...

Post by Turbo »

CLoneWolf wrote: ...ok this draft is nowhere near it, but I got carried away with orchestra hits... :roll:
http://olografix.org/groucho/vs/JingleDraft.ogg
I don't know if it fits the sports theme, maybe it's more a "breaking news" thing, for fate-changing news like cats stuck on trees and the like...
The link is not working for me. Clicking the link or pasting it into the address bar gets a 404 error, and Save Target As saves an HTM that gives a 404 error. This is with IE and Opera browsers.
CLoneWolf wrote: it seems that you're free to create a Rlaan.m3u playlist (actually the precise faction name to use is the one returned by GetFaction, it might be case sensitive) and it'll get automatically loaded.
Nice work. As you suggested, limiting news to factions may not be needed for a long time, so if we just add it to the "peace" playlist for now we should be fine.

My wife has agreed to be our news anchor. You will remember her as the voice of the merchant guild (http://www.willadsenfamily.org/VSvoice/ ... itizen.zip). As our news anchor, I will ask her to use a generic American English voice instead of the southern US accent she did for the merchant guild. Since there are tons of stories already in news.py, plus the ones this team has written, I will post her work as she gets them done.
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Re: And now, for something completely different...

Post by CLoneWolf »

Turbo wrote:
CLoneWolf wrote: ...ok this draft is nowhere near it, but I got carried away with orchestra hits... :roll:
http://olografix.org/groucho/vs/JingleDraft.ogg
I don't know if it fits the sports theme, maybe it's more a "breaking news" thing, for fate-changing news like cats stuck on trees and the like...
The link is not working for me. Clicking the link or pasting it into the address bar gets a 404 error, and Save Target As saves an HTM that gives a 404 error. This is with IE and Opera browsers.
Very weird, I published it just like any other previous content and even checked it now with Opera (I normally use Firefox) so that wasn't even picked from a local cache, and it works; the only weird thing I noticed on Opera is that in the open/save dialog it mentions a JingleDraft.ogx (notice .ogx) which of course does not exist, but if I go on it saves or plays the real .ogg. Meh?!?
I could attach it here but it's half a Megabyte, is that too big?
Besides, after listening to it again, it occurred to me that in this jingle I unawarily cloned another VS original track: the very 1st one you hear when you load the game! (which is one of my favorites)
Turbo wrote:As you suggested, limiting news to factions may not be needed for a long time, so if we just add it to the "peace" playlist for now we should be fine.
Agreed!
Turbo wrote:My wife has agreed to be our news anchor. You will remember her as the voice of the merchant guild (http://www.willadsenfamily.org/VSvoice/ ... itizen.zip). As our news anchor, I will ask her to use a generic American English voice instead of the southern US accent she did for the merchant guild. Since there are tons of stories already in news.py, plus the ones this team has written, I will post her work as she gets them done.
YAY! :D I sure do remember, just as you will remember her to be the 1st guest star voice in Another Day in Vegastrike, the silly unofficial alternate soundtrack that started this behemoth topic ;)
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Re: And now, for something completely different...

Post by Turbo »

I'm updating the wiki with some stuff from this thread that wasn't already moved there. By the way, should our news stories be added to news.py somehow?

I was able to download your jingle today. I think it's great for a sportscast jingle...we can play the first 3 seconds, fade it out when the sports anchor starts talking, then fade it back in at the end of the sports story. I'll play with it to find the right timing.

And since I forgot to say this before, I think that we should play your song "Another Day in Vegastrike" on the game's credits screen.
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Re: And now, for something completely different...

Post by Turbo »

OK, the wiki updates are done, including some new audio I made to keep things going: news header and footer components, and a few other things.
http://vegastrike.sourceforge.net/media ... ical_Audio
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Re: And now, for something completely different...

Post by CLoneWolf »

Turbo wrote:I'm updating the wiki with some stuff from this thread that wasn't already moved there. By the way, should our news stories be added to news.py somehow?
Personally, I don't see any reasons not to :) If those news had a somehow hard-coded impact on the game progress, added news should take care of those side effects as well; but since this doesn't seem the case as of now, the more the better, right?
Turbo wrote:I was able to download your jingle today. I think it's great for a sportscast jingle...we can play the first 3 seconds, fade it out when the sports anchor starts talking, then fade it back in at the end of the sports story. I'll play with it to find the right timing.
Thanks for your appreciation :) Of course I can make a longer version with the second loop repeated enough times to cover the longest news speech we might want to add; do you think I should try to add a final to the jingle?
Turbo wrote:And since I forgot to say this before, I think that we should play your song "Another Day in Vegastrike" on the game's credits screen.
Do you really think so?? Actually, the most daring use I could think of was as soundtrack of game trailers contributed by players, surely not as part of the official content! :roll:
Anyway, if consensus is reached about its official inclusion, it'll need to be completely redone (any real singers available? :roll: ) as the existing one is just a draft.

Great job with the wiki updates, can't wait to check the new audio snippets :)
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Re: And now, for something completely different...

Post by www2 »

Be side our own music we we can use also music form the shelf.

this include all music under cc-by or cc-by-sa licenses and magnatune.com

And we make a list form artist that we can ask that we use his music in vega strike and older open source project's.
the only artist that i know that we can ask are the Rednex (a Swedish manufactured techno/folk/bluegrass band out 1994 that form 07-01-2010 publist his song on the piratebay)
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Re: And now, for something completely different...

Post by Turbo »

While the forums and wiki were down, I spent some time testing, using the one news and one commercial recording we have completed. I could not get consistent results until I added the items to all the peaceful playlists. So now I can fly to Terran, Rlaan, and Aera space (after hacking relationships to make everyone love me) and hear the news and commercial audio playing among the music. So I think we have the "way ahead" figured out, there.

Last night I recorded the Fuzzy's Chicken call-in contest. I'm not sure if I like it, so feedback is welcome:
http://www.willadsenfamily.org/VSvoice/ ... hicken.ogg
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Re: And now, for something completely different...

Post by CLoneWolf »

Turbo wrote:While the forums and wiki were down, I spent some time testing, using the one news and one commercial recording we have completed. I could not get consistent results until I added the items to all the peaceful playlists. So now I can fly to Terran, Rlaan, and Aera space (after hacking relationships to make everyone love me) and hear the news and commercial audio playing among the music. So I think we have the "way ahead" figured out, there.
\o/ The galactic spammers will be grateful to you! :mrgreen:
Turbo wrote:Last night I recorded the Fuzzy's Chicken call-in contest. I'm not sure if I like it, so feedback is welcome:
http://www.willadsenfamily.org/VSvoice/ ... hicken.ogg
Even though I knew the script already, I found it funny and I liked a little detail especially: the chicken and jump sounds as they're first mentioned; what leaves you unsure?

Good job on the other snippets posted on the wiki too, and good idea to spawn separate threads like the one for ads, this one can be too stormy even for brainstorming :roll:
...and by "stormy" i'm *not* suggesting to add galactic weather forecast, that'd be too much even for my insanity.
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