Questions about ships in extendet PR

Forum For Privateer Remake

Questions about ships in extendet PR

Postby Aragon » Wed Jul 18, 2007 8:27 am

I added PU 1b6-DSE to my normal Privateer Remake so i have some ships more then orginal.
Question for me is now is there any ship avaible in this pool faster then the orginal Centurion with 1.000kps ?
Cuz my own stupidness i deleted my save so i have to repeat the storyline again, and for the contraband-runs it would be extrem helpfull to have a faster ship to prevent fights with militia or confeds.
Anyone a clue ?
User avatar
Aragon
Trader
Trader
 
Posts: 18
Topics: 2
Joined: Mon Sep 12, 2005 11:51 am

Share On:

Share on Facebook Facebook Share on Twitter Twitter Share on Digg Digg

Postby MamiyaOtaru » Wed Jul 18, 2007 12:48 pm

I'm not sure which ships you've made available for yourself, but the demon and stiletto are faster. They don't have a ton of cargo room though ;)
MamiyaOtaru
Privateer
 
Posts: 729
Topics: 20
Joined: Tue Jan 07, 2003 1:32 am

Postby Aragon » Wed Jul 18, 2007 1:53 pm

Just noticed the Raptor is ways faster, but whats about the cargo space ?
Just 15 tons and max 28 tons when i upgrade (which wasnt possible in hangar when i tried it).
Is that enought for the storyline missions or is more space not required ?


And btw, where can i get this Fusion cannons, i heard about but found no shop to buy em (i hope i dont mix names now, i think it was the fusion cannon i heard here first time).
User avatar
Aragon
Trader
Trader
 
Posts: 18
Topics: 2
Joined: Mon Sep 12, 2005 11:51 am

Postby MamiyaOtaru » Wed Jul 18, 2007 9:18 pm

The Fusion Cannon was added to the original Privateer in the Righteous Fire addon. To get ahold of it in Privateer Remake, finish the original campaign and begin the Righteous Fire campaign.
MamiyaOtaru
Privateer
 
Posts: 729
Topics: 20
Joined: Tue Jan 07, 2003 1:32 am

Postby Aragon » Thu Jul 19, 2007 3:07 am

I see....
I finished privateer long ago in 1995 but never had the pleasure to play RF.
thanx for the info man.




Another point, i had a mission in Vahlhala and in the temple of Eden the retros offerd me a ship to buy, nothing special, but steltek cannons onboard.
I wanted these guns but wasnt able to buy the ship, 400.000,- was the price, i had just about 200.000,-.
When i came later back with enought money the ship was gone.
Im told this can happen randomly, are there other ships u can buy from time to time ?
User avatar
Aragon
Trader
Trader
 
Posts: 18
Topics: 2
Joined: Mon Sep 12, 2005 11:51 am

Postby Rezaele » Thu Jul 19, 2007 3:19 am

Hi Aragon,

IMHO, it will be better if you post your question in the forums here http://pu.wcjunction.com/ since your using the Parallel Universe mod. They can respond to your queries better especially as to what ships they made available in it.

HTH
Image
User avatar
Rezaele
Explorer
Explorer
 
Posts: 14
Joined: Mon May 28, 2007 8:25 pm
Location: Philippines

Postby Dilloh » Thu Jul 19, 2007 6:11 am

Yes, I'd recommend this for future questions. We're not too present around here any more.

To answer your question, DSE contains a ship called fireblade which runs faster than any other ship, and holds a cloak as well (ctrl+c). This should make your smuggling life a lot easier, though we're going to hide the ship a bit better within the next version.
User avatar
Dilloh
Elite Hunter
Elite Hunter
 
Posts: 1149
Topics: 25
Joined: Mon Aug 14, 2006 8:56 am
Location: Black Forest, Germany

Postby chuck_starchaser » Thu Jul 19, 2007 9:56 am

Evan at a ships dealer, you shouldn't see a cloaking ship unless you bump your head on it :D
Just curious, where does the Fireblade come from? AFAIK, the confies have only one cloaking ship in 2669; --the Excalibur. They had experimental cloaking systems in 2668, and Taggart flies a cloaking ship deep into Kilrathi territory to photograph their hidden supercarrier shipyard in Hari; but this was super secret squirrel stuff...
User avatar
chuck_starchaser
Elite
Elite
 
Posts: 8014
Topics: 195
Joined: Thu Sep 04, 2003 9:03 pm
Location: Montreal

Postby Dilloh » Thu Jul 19, 2007 11:55 am

I've tried to turn around the story a bit...

Priv plays in 2669, so in order to have the confederation using a working cloaking device, they actually need a prototype. This prototype wasn't nessecarily produced by a military engineer. In my story, it was a civilian engineer working for a cooperation. The feds hear about that, and want to arrest him in order to let him work day and night to get an adequate cloak. But instead the engineer flees to the grey zone of Gemini and hides out there until he meets Burrows who actually helps him to make a deal with the feds.

Man, I think that's cool, I'll rewrite the story a bit to be more like that.

Btw only the player is able to use the cloak - luckily the AI doesn't use it, so I had to invent a story about a special chip or software to enable the on-board cloak which Burrows gets as a reward for his help. Still this solution is a bit strange, for it would mean that all the other FB pilots would be flying around without knowing they actually have cloaks onboard. I could use a better explanation therefor. Any thoughts?

And don't tell me that the ship will be only available at the scientist's base... as soon as you tractored in a FB you'd have it with cloaking capability anyway.

Hmm... I guess I'll make an ani where Burrows gets a handy "module" which he'll plug into his ship and voilà...

EDIT:
Oh and if you're wondering where the idea for the Fireblade actually came from, well I have a friend who owns a Honda Fireblade, make that owned, when he wanted me to show how cool his machine is, he just missed that there's a curve and vanished into a wood - he quasi cloaked :lol:
/EDIT
User avatar
Dilloh
Elite Hunter
Elite Hunter
 
Posts: 1149
Topics: 25
Joined: Mon Aug 14, 2006 8:56 am
Location: Black Forest, Germany

Postby MamiyaOtaru » Thu Jul 19, 2007 2:46 pm

Ah yes, use of a mod means there are a few ships I am not aware of. The mod's forum is the place to ask questions then, as I am mainly equipped to answer questions about the standard unmodified game.
MamiyaOtaru
Privateer
 
Posts: 729
Topics: 20
Joined: Tue Jan 07, 2003 1:32 am

Postby Aragon » Thu Jul 19, 2007 4:52 pm

unmodified game.....is it allready that long ago so i have problems to seperate orginal and modified parts of the game..apart from all these extra ships lol.
Well, i think i will check this other forum too, next to this one.
All these diff mods doesnt make its easier lol
;)
User avatar
Aragon
Trader
Trader
 
Posts: 18
Topics: 2
Joined: Mon Sep 12, 2005 11:51 am

Postby chuck_starchaser » Thu Jul 19, 2007 11:53 pm

Sorry, MO, I'm not sure how this thread ended up in your forum.

Dilloh wrote:I've tried to turn around the story a bit...

Priv plays in 2669, so in order to have the confederation using a working cloaking device, they actually need a prototype. This prototype wasn't nessecarily produced by a military engineer. In my story, it was a civilian engineer working for a cooperation. The feds hear about that, and want to arrest him in order to let him work day and night to get an adequate cloak. But instead the engineer flees to the grey zone of Gemini and hides out there until he meets Burrows who actually helps him to make a deal with the feds.

Man, I think that's cool, I'll rewrite the story a bit to be more like that.

It IS very cool. Any chance you could move this subplot to the later parts of PU? Tell you why. By late 2670 there's already a civilian guy flying a cloaking ship: Zacharias Banfeld, founder of The Guild, in the Landreich. He obtained the cloaking device from the kats. The Guild thrived during the war, by being the only haulers organization that transported cargo along the "gray zones", --dozens of "unofficial systems"-- spanning the the border areas between Confed, Border Worlds, Landreich and Kilrah. So he has deals with the kats, and maybe your scientist met with him, got samples of kitty cloaks to reverse engineer, plus money; and in exchange he promised he would produce cloaks for The Guild's ships. But maybe he wasn't lucky with the first and second generation prototypes, Zack grew impatient, and at some point he flees all the way to Gemini, as far as he can get from Zach and The Guild. He should be hiding at a mine, to follow Privateer traditions :)



Btw only the player is able to use the cloak - luckily the AI doesn't use it, so I had to invent a story about a special chip or software to enable the on-board cloak which Burrows gets as a reward for his help. Still this solution is a bit strange, for it would mean that all the other FB pilots would be flying around without knowing they actually have cloaks onboard. I could use a better explanation therefor. Any thoughts?

There are too many stories of missing key parts in movies and literature; even in fantasy plots, where you need to find a magical ring or something... better to avoid cliches where possible. I'd say he thinks he knows how to make cloaks that work, but, for one, he fears being found by The Guild. For another, he's a socially responsible engineer who fears the consequences of the technology, should it get into wrong hands. The war is over, and he knows about the Belisarius plans to re-ignite it (from Zachary Banfeld, who had connections to Belisarius, which is part of the reason he fell out of love with The Guild and decided to escape).

EDIT:
Alternatively, he first heard about Belisarius and Y-12 while working for Confed Secret Projects on cloaking technology, and decided to escape to the Landreich. There he fell in love with The Guild, and got a safehaven from them, plus everything he needed to work on the project. Then he learns that The Guild has dealings with Belisarius and also wants to see the war re-ignited; and so then he escapes again; this time to Gemini... ;-)
User avatar
chuck_starchaser
Elite
Elite
 
Posts: 8014
Topics: 195
Joined: Thu Sep 04, 2003 9:03 pm
Location: Montreal

Postby Dilloh » Fri Jul 20, 2007 2:28 am

It IS very cool. Any chance you could move this subplot to the later parts of PU?
It is currently a side campaign, so accessable at any time of the game. But I could force it to happen after Jones is dead.
By late 2670 there's already a civilian guy flying a cloaking ship: Zacharias Banfeld, founder of The Guild, in the Landreich. He obtained the cloaking device from the kats. The Guild thrived during the war, by being the only haulers organization that transported cargo along the "gray zones", --dozens of "unofficial systems"-- spanning the the border areas between Confed, Border Worlds, Landreich and Kilrah. So he has deals with the kats, and maybe your scientist met with him, got samples of kitty cloaks to reverse engineer, plus money; and in exchange he promised he would produce cloaks for The Guild's ships. But maybe he wasn't lucky with the first and second generation prototypes, Zack grew impatient, and at some point he flees all the way to Gemini, as far as he can get from Zach and The Guild.
Side question: was the Excalibur cloak stolen from the cats? The point is, the FB cloak is a very rough type of cloak, it needs about 20 seconds to cloak/decloak. One could argue it is a human-developed cloak that was forgotten later. Reasonable?
He should be hiding at a mine, to follow Privateer traditions
I have him on a low-frequented refinery to provide hin with all the tech he needs to keep on engineering.
There are too many stories of missing key parts in movies and literature; even in fantasy plots, where you need to find a magical ring or something... better to avoid cliches where possible. I'd say he thinks he knows how to make cloaks that work, but, for one, he fears being found by The Guild. For another, he's a socially responsible engineer who fears the consequences of the technology, should it get into wrong hands. The war is over, and he knows about the Belisarius plans to re-ignite it (from Zachary Banfeld, who had connections to Belisarius, which is part of the reason he fell out of love with The Guild and decided to escape).

EDIT:
Alternatively, he first heard about Belisarius and Y-12 while working for Confed Secret Projects on cloaking technology, and decided to escape to the Landreich. There he fell in love with The Guild, and got a safehaven from them, plus everything he needed to work on the project. Then he learns that The Guild has dealings with Belisarius and also wants to see the war re-ignited; and so then he escapes again; this time to Gemini...
No no, you misunderstood. I have problems with the engine's limitations: AI Fireblades don't cloak, but that's okay. Though AI Fireblades are capable of cloaking as soon as I tractored them in and use them for myself. So, all FBs are cloakable. So, I need to find an explanation why ONLY the player knows how to cloak a Fireblade - which leads to currently only one explanation that he has a special item allowing it.

Alternatively I could either make AI use other FB typos which don't have cloaks, so that Burrows gets a special one, or make the FB not so milspec and give it a cloak slot for this engineer's cloak so that he can "buy" the cloak at the engineer's base as a special item.
User avatar
Dilloh
Elite Hunter
Elite Hunter
 
Posts: 1149
Topics: 25
Joined: Mon Aug 14, 2006 8:56 am
Location: Black Forest, Germany

Postby chuck_starchaser » Fri Jul 20, 2007 6:10 am

Yes, the Excalibur cloak is Confed developed cloaking tech

Well, what I was trying to do was come up with an alternative story that
a) Makes for a more believable and interesting background for this engineer
b) Explains better why he ended up in Gemini
c) Ties in stories about cloak technology currently in canon (Banfeld)
d) Explains why the engineer doesn't have anything to show for all his work
e) Explains why he might later be agreeable to work on it for Burrows
f) Delays cloaking technology to 2670+, to avoid canon conflicts, but more importantly, to avoid having to actually have cloaking ships, whether by the AI's OR even by the player; as cloaking technology is unbalanced and not really too much fun, though the process of trying to get it can be fun. Once you get it, though, the game is basically over... like giving yourself Stetlek guns, Flashpak, or plain invulnerability. Beside the fact that that the technology itself is not terribly believable in Science Fiction in general (not that jump points and tractor beams are any more believable).
But, granted, my alternative story would leave out the Fireblade entirely.
Okay, never mind. :)
User avatar
chuck_starchaser
Elite
Elite
 
Posts: 8014
Topics: 195
Joined: Thu Sep 04, 2003 9:03 pm
Location: Montreal

Postby zeo1234 » Sat Jul 28, 2007 9:55 pm

How about this, the engineer was a Shield generator engineer trying to make a more efficient shield generator when he stumbled on a configuration that could create a cloak effect.


The problem is it was very inefficient and used up way too much ship power.

So simply wasn't practicle at first.


Could even say it was considered a glitch.


Someone in the confeds gets interested but instead of coming right out and expressing their interests they try to arrest the engineer with trumped up charges so as to not attract attention to why they want him.

He of course runs for it and goes into hiding.

And when he meets Burrows he's working on some backwards sector as a ship engineer trying to etch out a living.

He recognizes the Thunderbird shield system as being the same type he was working on before he had to go into hiding. Burrows hears his story and gets interested in the glitch.

Engineer recreates the glitch and ship cloaks, Burrows pays him to perfect it.

After using it confeds contacts Burrows and he brokers deal for the technology.

Considering it was a glitch it will take the engineer a few years to make an actual cloaking system that could be installed in a confed ship like the Excalibur so fits.

Also explains why other Thunderbirds can't cloak since it is really their shield generators need to be reconfigured to use the glitch and only Burrows has the software for that.

What do you think?
User avatar
zeo1234
Mercenary
Mercenary
 
Posts: 106
Joined: Sun Aug 06, 2006 9:04 pm

Postby Dilloh » Sun Jul 29, 2007 7:39 am

Not bad... not perfect, but much more reasonable. You're right, cloaking technology is related to shielding in all scifi-stories I can tell.

This would also be a good explanation to me for insisting on a Lev1 or even 0.5 shield generator - the scientist has not scripted the software/values for higher shields yet.

I wish I could hack in more things into the game engine, like activating the cloak has, let's say a 30% chance of doing damage to the cloaking ships reactor. Unfortuately, I cannot even let the cloak energy deplete. If the reactor or fuel cell runs out of power, the ship just doesn't decloak. Instead you cannot decloak it any more! :cry: It'd be much easier to explain why nobody uses a cloak in 2669 though it is there if I could put in those hazards for cloak users.
User avatar
Dilloh
Elite Hunter
Elite Hunter
 
Posts: 1149
Topics: 25
Joined: Mon Aug 14, 2006 8:56 am
Location: Black Forest, Germany

Postby chuck_starchaser » Sun Jul 29, 2007 7:42 am

Well, shields are "magitech", cloaks are "magitech", and neither can even conceivably be given too much of an explanation. They aren't even pseudoscience; they might as well have been invented by elves and powered by gnomes; so whatever story you'd make up about the engineer, you'd want to call attention to the human aspects and to the politics, and help the player mercifully forget the tech aspect.

What you're doing, calling it "a glitch", is precisely to draw the player's attention to the technical aspects: "Could cloak technology really be hiding in shield technology all along?" Of course, there's no answer to the question, since we know how neither shields nor cloak work, but in the meantime, my immersion has suffered terribly, just from thinking about it.

That's what bothered me a bit in Dilloh's version too: The missing chip that enables the cloak to work: it would just make me think --"Where does the chip go? What kind of socket?", as a player; but I don't want to think; because as soon as I start to think about the magitech, I am reminded of how absurd it is and my immersion suffers.

EDIT:
We posted at the same time Dilloh. Anyways, my point stands. The more attention you draw to thechnical aspects of magitech, the worse it is. Look at Startrek: What does all the pseudoscience blabbing do for it? They could have just got rid of it all; wouldn't have lost a single fan, and would have allowed someone like me to watch it.
User avatar
chuck_starchaser
Elite
Elite
 
Posts: 8014
Topics: 195
Joined: Thu Sep 04, 2003 9:03 pm
Location: Montreal

Postby OnyxPaladin » Sun Jul 29, 2007 7:40 pm

He's on to us, remodulate!
For every ounce of courage, every drope of hope..
A gallon of blood paid in advance...
OnyxPaladin
Bounty Hunter
Bounty Hunter
 
Posts: 133
Topics: 1
Joined: Mon Jul 31, 2006 9:46 pm

Postby Dilloh » Mon Jul 30, 2007 3:15 am

Well, shields are "magitech", cloaks are "magitech", and neither can even conceivably be given too much of an explanation. They aren't even pseudoscience; they might as well have been invented by elves and powered by gnomes; so whatever story you'd make up about the engineer, you'd want to call attention to the human aspects and to the politics, and help the player mercifully forget the tech aspect.
Sound effects in space are impossible unless you fill the galaxy with gas. Jump drives will leave a red painting formally known as the pilot at the wall. Lasers, Mesons, whatever should move at light speed, and not appear as bolts, rather as beams. The chance that there's another equally developed and intelligent race in space is near zero. The chance that those guys look like cats, or birds, ARE zero. And how can you shoot your guns with shields up?!? The list is endless. I know we have a timeline we need to respect, but I really think having A SINGLE cloak available just one year before the confederation uses their, is reasonable, though there is no novel or game telling about it.
What you're doing, calling it "a glitch", is precisely to draw the player's attention to the technical aspects: "Could cloak technology really be hiding in shield technology all along?" Of course, there's no answer to the question, since we know how neither shields nor cloak work, but in the meantime, my immersion has suffered terribly, just from thinking about it.
I actually don't know how a cloak could work, or would. In Star Wars Episode IV, the Star Destroyer Commander who lost the Millenium Falcon from screen states that a ship of that (small) size cannot have a cloaking device. In Star Trek, ships have cloaks you rip out and build in something else, or use them for buildings or even people. In WC, the cats use it on light Varkoths, and the feds on heavy Excaliburs. There seems to be no limitation. I'm interpreting the cloak as a device which modulates your shields to create the effect. That's why your shields go down - they're being used for the effect.
That's what bothered me a bit in Dilloh's version too: The missing chip that enables the cloak to work: it would just make me think --"Where does the chip go? What kind of socket?"
This bothers me too, I often have to deal with those problems. Is it a chip? A software? My explanation is for now, that Burrows gets a software, or a code, which modifies his special shield generator to work as a cloak. For the REAL cloak, a device will be invented which figures out this value for every shield generator available - much faster and more precisely, so you have a better invisibility effect.
but I don't want to think; because as soon as I start to think about the magitech, I am reminded of how absurd it is and my immersion suffers.
If you REALLY like SciFi, you need to forget about magitech. Or do WoW players damn their game just for there never existed any Elves, Orcs, or Dwarfs? (Okay dwarfs exist but they don't live in caves :lol: )
Look at Startrek: What does all the pseudoscience blabbing do for it? They could have just got rid of it all; wouldn't have lost a single fan, and would have allowed someone like me to watch it.
LOL, Star Trek is a problem on its own. Just think of the Heisenberg-Compensators: If there's a physical problem, get rid of it with "compensators". The problem is, Star Trek was invented in 1966 when nobody had an idea of space. The TOS series had that severe physical errors that TNG, DS9, VOY and ENT is still in heavy need to explain that. I don't want to loose myself in endless ingame dialogues that explain why there is a magitech. But it was you who was telling me "you need to explain why this is possible, at this place, at this time" and I'm convinced.

The cloak is the most severe problem in PU, and I ultimatively won't insist on it. I just thought it would be nice to have it, since it is fully implemented in VS, and a pity to let in unused. Other problems, e.g. why are having hunters a base at the cat border, are things which are discussable, which don't affect physics. I don't want to fire up a poll about the cloak in PU, I know things like that caused problems in the past. I know your point about the cloak and magitech, and I fully respect it. This is nothing that will fork our ways, okay :wink:
He's on to us, remodulate!
:lol: Btw, the funniest thing in Star Trek is replicators. Damn, why don't they just place solar collectors around every sun and create the energy they need to run vast replicators and replicate all starships they need instead of building them? And man them with holograms so every man can live on earth, eat replicated T-Bones and let their Holograms do slavery work?

Where no Hologram has gone before
User avatar
Dilloh
Elite Hunter
Elite Hunter
 
Posts: 1149
Topics: 25
Joined: Mon Aug 14, 2006 8:56 am
Location: Black Forest, Germany

Postby OnyxPaladin » Mon Jul 30, 2007 8:34 pm

Dilloh wrote:
The chance that there's another equally developed and intelligent race in space is near zero.


No offense intended, but his is a very ignorant and small minded thing to say. It seems you don't quite realize how meaningless numbers become in the vastness of space. (this is not exact, it's been a while since i heard this) The Hubble telescope found that the haze surround our galaxy was actually made up of strands. These strands are made up of billions clusters, which are comprised of billions of galaxies; and there are more strands than can be counted. Think about how small the area the hubble can observe, numbers are meaningless in space. Considering this, it is statiscally impossible for there to be no other life in the universe. As for an equally developed race, what makes you think we are so special? Looking at humanity as a whole we seem very unspecial IMO. It is very unlikely to say the least that there are no races as, if not much more advanced than us.

Carbon based lifeforms are dominant on this planet. What makes you certain there are no silicone based lifeforms having their own wars and corrupt governments? Solar flares are a bane of most all life that we know of, but if we've survived why couldn't others? Think for a moment about all the knowledge you've gained in your life, now think about the sheer amount of knowledge known by humanity as a whole. You and i know nothing in comparison. Again, i mean no offense, but such small thinking bothers me. Especially from a fellow German.

Btw, the funniest thing in Star Trek is replicators. Damn, why don't they just place solar collectors around every sun and create the energy they need to run vast replicators and replicate all starships they need instead of building them? And man them with holograms so every man can live on earth, eat replicated T-Bones and let their Holograms do slavery work?
IIRC the replicator need raw materials in addition to a signifcant power source.[/u]
For every ounce of courage, every drope of hope..
A gallon of blood paid in advance...
OnyxPaladin
Bounty Hunter
Bounty Hunter
 
Posts: 133
Topics: 1
Joined: Mon Jul 31, 2006 9:46 pm

Postby Dilloh » Tue Jul 31, 2007 2:15 am

OnyxPaladin wrote:
I wrote:The chance that there's another equally developed and intelligent race in space is near zero.
No offense intended, but his is a very ignorant and small minded thing to say. It seems you don't quite realize how meaningless numbers become in the vastness of space.
I'm sorry, you're right, but add "in our range" and we're done I guess.
Carbon based lifeforms are dominant on this planet. What makes you certain there are no silicone based lifeforms having their own wars and corrupt governments?
If there are/were silicon based lifeforms, I guess they aren't/wouldn't be using starfighters.

Guys, all I wanted to state is that cats with furs, eyes and claws, and sharp ears and all the stuff are a speciality from earth. The chance is somewhat zero that you encounter human-sized cats in space.
IIRC the replicator need raw materials in addition to a signifcant power source.
No, it represents the tech of turning energy to mass, while the opposite mass to energy is already available (e.g. try burning down your house => mass to energy). There was a VOY episode when to ferengi in a shuttle crashed on a planet in the Delta quad. They could only rescue their replicator, but needed to hide it from the people on the planet in order to appear like magicians. So they had nothing to "feed" the replicator with. And you never see something like that in any ST episode.
/OT
User avatar
Dilloh
Elite Hunter
Elite Hunter
 
Posts: 1149
Topics: 25
Joined: Mon Aug 14, 2006 8:56 am
Location: Black Forest, Germany

Postby OnyxPaladin » Tue Jul 31, 2007 8:03 pm

Dilloh wrote:Guys, all I wanted to state is that cats with furs, eyes and claws, and sharp ears and all the stuff are a speciality from earth. The chance is somewhat zero that you encounter human-sized cats in space.


I agree.

No, it represents the tech of turning energy to mass, while the opposite mass to energy is already available (e.g. try burning down your house => mass to energy). There was a VOY episode when to ferengi in a shuttle crashed on a planet in the Delta quad. They could only rescue their replicator, but needed to hide it from the people on the planet in order to appear like magicians. So they had nothing to "feed" the replicator with. And you never see something like that in any ST episode.
/OT


Forgot about that episode. guess i should remodulate my brain.
For every ounce of courage, every drope of hope..
A gallon of blood paid in advance...
OnyxPaladin
Bounty Hunter
Bounty Hunter
 
Posts: 133
Topics: 1
Joined: Mon Jul 31, 2006 9:46 pm

Postby zeo1234 » Wed Aug 08, 2007 7:55 am

Actually replicators are an application of the Transporter technology in Star Trek.

So they do primary use raw material, as that is the most energy efficient method, but can also use energy directly. The thing to remember is it doesn't really matter.

Matter is energy, just another form from what people normally think of.

In fact matter isn't even really solid, we're all composed of energy fields that interact and give the illusion of solidness.

The Replicators can also use any form of matter to make anything else, it's just more efficient to turn things into the same, like taking food and just re-arranging the molecules to a cooked state. Versus taking something totally unrelated and altering it's atomic structure to become food, etc.

Also the more complex the final object the longer it'll take to make and the more energy it will take to create it.


The chances of another world producing intelligent life is about the same as winning the lottery, low but hardly impossible and considering how people have won the lottery a pretty high chance. All that really is required is that no mass extinctions occur long enough for intelligent life to have a chance to develop.

It is the natural course of evolution that all life evolves towards more complex forms.

So developing intelligence is only a matter of time.

As to what they can look like, it all depends on which species is given a chance to evolve.

Cat people may seem unlikely but it is hardly impossible. Though we are assuming just because the Kilrathi look like cats that they actually evolved from cats. They could resemble what we consider cat like qualities but could have evolved from a totally different evolutionary path.


And since NASA and the military are already working on shield and cloaking technology I wouldn't go so far as go them magictech.

NASA for example has already had some success in creating a plasma based energy shield that may one day protect astronauts from radiation and micro-meteorites, etc.

And of course it's just a matter of pumping enough power into the system after that to protect against actual weapons.

DARPA is also working on light bending technology, including ones based on energy fields.

As well as other cool things like they just figured out how to reverse the Casimir effect, which means they can make magnetic fields repulse instead of attract. So tractor and repulsor beams are technically possible.

Even Replicators are being created, they can't of course alter molecular structures or anything like that but they are building machines that can take raw materials and use it to create anything you want through the computer.

Like using a printer to create circuit boards, or a prototyping machine that will create an actual physical cast of an object created in CAD. And they are even making a machine that will automatically process food and give you a meal. So its not like such technology is totally impossible, just beyond our present capabilities.


Remember, Privateer, WC, etc is basically a sci-fi and the basic tenants of a sci-fi is that it has to be based on actual science. Though of course they can stretch things, like gate system, etc are things we have theorized but have no proof if possible yet. But that doesn't mean everything is magictech.

Otherwise we'd be playing a fantasy game and dealing with Space Dragons and such. :roll:

Dilloh wrote:It'd be much easier to explain why nobody uses a cloak in 2669 though it is there if I could put in those hazards for cloak users.


How about keeping it simple and just say the cloak produces radiation?

So not something you would want running all the time, even if the radiation levels are low.
User avatar
zeo1234
Mercenary
Mercenary
 
Posts: 106
Joined: Sun Aug 06, 2006 9:04 pm

Postby Dilloh » Wed Aug 08, 2007 10:21 am

zeo1234 wrote:Cat people may seem unlikely but it is hardly impossible. Though we are assuming just because the Kilrathi look like cats that they actually evolved from cats. They could resemble what we consider cat like qualities but could have evolved from a totally different evolutionary path.
Agreed, but it is obvious to everyone that the Kilrathi are "large cats", for they
- have a for like cats
- have eyes like cats
- have claws like cats
- make attack sounds like cats (just a bit darker)
- have ears like cats
They're cats, given the attributes of Barbarians, or make that Klingons. Just wanted to say, when Chris Roberts was looking for an alien race, he didn't quite want to spend too much time on it and then he had... well, large cats. That's why I like the Steltek. The closest thing they remind me of is the slimy thing from "Alien" (the movie).
And since NASA and the military are already working on shield and cloaking technology I wouldn't go so far as go them magictech.
Well, overall, mankind has been working on extremely weird things, which doesn't mean that one will eventually succeed. During WWII the allies were planning an aircraft carrier - consisting of ice instead of metal.

Most elder sci-fi movies and books have in common that their vision of the future simply is too fast. Like Orwell's 1984, or Star Trek II with the clone wars being over in 1996 and Khan holding half of the world (unless Khan is a sheep named Dolly secretly ruling the world, it's just epic).
And of course it's just a matter of pumping enough power into the system after that to protect against actual weapons.
I don't think it is that easy. If it was, we'd already have a spaceship, consisting of 50 docked spaceshuttles, capable of doing warp 0.5.
Remember, Privateer, WC, etc is basically a sci-fi and the basic tenants of a sci-fi is that it has to be based on actual science.
The 27th century is the thing CR did correctly - unlike Star Trek, going back now until 2151.
How about keeping it simple and just say the cloak produces radiation?
I'm not looking for an explanation, I'm looking for a way how to tell the engine to damage the ship while using the cloak. Besides that, radiation is nonsense unless the ordinary reactor produces the radiation and stock shield generators provide the extra effort of shielding the cockpit from this menace.
User avatar
Dilloh
Elite Hunter
Elite Hunter
 
Posts: 1149
Topics: 25
Joined: Mon Aug 14, 2006 8:56 am
Location: Black Forest, Germany

Postby chuck_starchaser » Wed Aug 08, 2007 11:38 am

zeo1234 wrote:In fact matter isn't even really solid, we're all composed of energy fields that interact and give the illusion of solidness.

What's an "energy field"?

The Replicators can also use any form of matter to make anything else, it's just more efficient to turn things into the same, like taking food and just re-arranging the molecules to a cooked state. Versus taking something totally unrelated and altering it's atomic structure to become food, etc.

And how is the re-arranging accomplished? A microwave oven is inducing molecular vibrations by electromagnetic means; and molecular vibrations ARE heat, by definition. The treatment is homogeneous, not detailed. That's one thing; but if you're talking about detailed work of taking an atom of this and an atom of that, and bringing them together --when not *forcibly* bringing them together--, you're talking about detailed, remote manipulations at atomic scale that would take years for a hamburger more tasteless than McDonald's, if you did a million such atomic manipulations per second, if it were possible in the first place without any kind of manipulators.

Also the more complex the final object the longer it'll take to make and the more energy it will take to create it.

Make that "will never be made".

The chances of another world producing intelligent life is about the same as winning the lottery, low but hardly impossible and considering how people have won the lottery a pretty high chance. All that really is required is that no mass extinctions occur long enough for intelligent life to have a chance to develop.

Pure speculation. This is the 50 million dollar question in exobiology.

It is the natural course of evolution that all life evolves towards more complex forms.

Not even necessarily so. Evolution is mere adaptation to survive. The adaptations can go up or down in the scale of complexity. Sometimes organisms evolve by simplifying themselves, and shedding like 90% of their genetic material all at once.

So developing intelligence is only a matter of time.
We've only got one case study, --our own planet--; and that's not enough to extrapolate. You may be right or you may be wrong; but either way, you're jumping to conclusions.

And since NASA and the military are already working on shield and cloaking technology I wouldn't go so far as go them magictech.

Let me guess you've read this in Popular Science. Ever since I was a kid, Popular Science (and Popular Mechanics) have been putting out a continuous stream of sensationalist crap, none of which has ever materialized. And every article they try to back it up with NASA this or DARPA that... research. In truth, NASA will fund all kinds of crazy research, their philosophy being that among all the crazy ideas there might be a gem hiding. But to say that NASA is investigating something is as meaningless a statement as you can get, by the same token.

NASA for example has already had some success in creating a plasma based energy shield that may one day protect astronauts from radiation and micro-meteorites, etc.

Just radiation; not micrometeorites.

And of course it's just a matter of pumping enough power into the system after that to protect against actual weapons.

What kind of power? What kind of weapons? If we're talking about charged particles, that's one thing, as their charge is their handle: A magnetic field can cause their motion to curve. But particles and objects without electric charge would be immune to any kind of EM field. And so would be light-based weapons, such as lasers, whose only response to an EM field would be to rotate polarization.

DARPA is also working on light bending technology, including ones based on energy fields.

There's no such thing as "energy fields". That's a term borrowed from would-be sci-fi writers who don't have the first clue in the sciences. The term doesn't exist in physics, and is entirely meaningless; so, wherever you read that, know that they are pulling that out of a dark place. There are no fields of any kind known to bend light, except gravity, and only indirectly, by deforming space, rather than by excerting a force on the photons.

As well as other cool things like they just figured out how to reverse the Casimir effect, which means they can make magnetic fields repulse instead of attract. So tractor and repulsor beams are technically possible.

Got a link?

Even Replicators are being created, they can't of course alter molecular structures or anything like that but they are building machines that can take raw materials and use it to create anything you want through the computer.

I don't even understand this statement.

Like using a printer to create circuit boards, or a prototyping machine that will create an actual physical cast of an object created in CAD. And they are even making a machine that will automatically process food and give you a meal. So its not like such technology is totally impossible, just beyond our present capabilities.

If you're talking about printers that print in 3D, that's not rocket science; just a matter of getting some powder to stick together and stuff. It lends no credibility whatsoever to remote chemical synthesis.

Remember, Privateer, WC, etc is basically a sci-fi and the basic tenants of a sci-fi is that it has to be based on actual science.

Completely untrue. First of all, the Origin people didn't care at all about actual science, if we are to judge by the sizes and distances of planets, and having absurdities like a maximum speed in space. William Forstchen obviously gave much more of a damn, and in his novels he tries to repair and retcon the absurdities in WC, but he could only do so much...
Secondly, what you say, namely "the basic tenants of a sci-fi is that it has to be based on actual science" is the biggest lie I've heard in a long, long time. There's only a minuscule community of writers within the world of sci-fi that belive in upholding scientific plausibility. Arthur C. Clarke foremost among them. But even some authors that pretend to be "Hard Sci-Fi", like Robinson, are imposters.

Though of course they can stretch things, like gate system, etc are things we have theorized but have no proof if possible yet. But that doesn't mean everything is magictech.

Everything is not magitech; just what is.

Otherwise we'd be playing a fantasy game and dealing with Space Dragons and such. :roll:
Luckily it doesn't go that far, but pretty almost.
User avatar
chuck_starchaser
Elite
Elite
 
Posts: 8014
Topics: 195
Joined: Thu Sep 04, 2003 9:03 pm
Location: Montreal


Next

Return to Privateer Remake

Who is online

Users browsing this forum: No registered users and 1 guest