Destroy A Base In Under 5 Minutes

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TBwaar
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Destroy A Base In Under 5 Minutes

Post by TBwaar »

I destroyed New Constantinople in less than 5 minutes. How? With my legitimate fleet of 100+ Steltek fighters of course:

http://vegastrike.sourceforge.net/galle ... temId=6649

The pregame took a while. But once I had my paradigm loaded up with 38 fighters (and another paradigm) I was ready to role. New Constantinople didn't have a chance:

http://vegastrike.sourceforge.net/galle ... temId=6647

And yes, that's my demon with four boosted stelteks. 8)
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Post by Privateer Ferrius »

Just because you didnt hack the save for it doesn't make it 'legitimate' :P
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Post by TBwaar »

Are you saying that a "legitimate steltek fleet" is an oxymoron? Are you saying this because you cannot normally "buy" a steltek ship? I consider legitimate to mean done without hacks or any editting to the game (aka just playing the game normally and abusing any "bugs" that you can, like the fact that you can still buy the paradigm.)

Nonetheless, if you are saying that, I'll try to do the same thing only with broadswords. Of course friendly fire will be a problem but i imagine 200 or so can do the job, if VegaStrike can handle it.
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Post by Privateer Ferrius »

Dude, if I found that many steltek ships in the game, Id RUN.
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Post by TBwaar »

Hehe, yeah so would I. Good thing you only need one to build a fleet. That's one of the bugs in the game. Once you sell something, you can keep buying it.

I did the same thing, this time with a bunch of confed ships. Hopefully this at least will meet your definition of legit:

http://vegastrike.sourceforge.net/galle ... temId=6651

There were somewhere between 200 and 300 broadswords (too many to count) as well as some stillettos and gladius. Again, short work was made of New C:

http://vegastrike.sourceforge.net/galle ... temId=6653

With that many ships one the screen, it got quite laggy. They got the job done almost as fast as the steltek however.
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Post by Privateer Ferrius »

I'd hardly call an exploit legit, although its considerably less shady than hacking ;)
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Post by TBwaar »

I guess it's kind of arbitrary what you consider and exploit to be. If it's not the intent of the creater for me to be able to do this, maybe it should be fixed in the next version. Either way, i think i should get some credit for figuring out how to make such a huge fleet in either the case of the steltek or confed ships.
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Post by Privateer Ferrius »

I can't speak for the developer's intent, but getting 200 Steltek ships is definetely a bit ... out there. I'm all for having a fleet you buy and control, but Steltek ships is a bit unbalancing.

At least it's not Nephilim.
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Post by TBwaar »

I agree. You have to keep in mind that the fleet is only a temporary thing. True you could have as many as 66 fighters in your paradigm which is unbalanced, but so is having 100 broadswords, and there's no way for me to keep those 200+ broadswords I had in the screen shots because i can only tracktor so many of them and i can only land one paradigm.

After all this, I think we're basically getting at the unbalanced nature of the paradigm. With a cargo hold of 100,000, there's not much of a limit to the kind of destruction you can cause. You can also make tons of cash. It IS pretty cool that you can buy a ship like it, but it does need to be toned down quite a bit at least in the area of cargo capacity, or you should have to do more to get one than complete the PR missions and have a cash reserve of 8.7 mil. I guess if nothing else this serves to show how unbalanced it is.
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Post by Privateer Ferrius »

Believe it or not, it's actually less powerful than the original; the original had sheilds that were virtually inpenetrable by fighter fire. I really think that gettin any milspec fighters, let alone capships should be made a lot more difficult than it is now.
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Post by TBwaar »

Yeah, shields all around seem weaker in the remake, maybe it's just me. I have found the paradigm especially has weaker shields, but the cargo space makes it up 10 fold. With 100 broadsword wingmen, you don't need the shields. Plus it still has super thick armor.

Speaking of the original, i think i'll load it up. It's been a while since i've tried to best a real asteroid field.
Last edited by TBwaar on Sun Mar 26, 2006 11:18 pm, edited 2 times in total.
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Post by Privateer Ferrius »

I've been catching up with the original Wing Commander myself. My god, I'd happily forgetten how infuriating minefields can be.

The Paradigm should probably have a larger fighter complement if we're sticking to canon, but in the interests of game balance, I wouldn't change it.
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Post by newB »

All those ships look cool but you never say how you did it. you say legitimate but how can i do this? i have paradigm but it only fits 100 broadswords and you say you have 200. how can you get so many ships.
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Post by TBwaar »

I suppose my claim would be more credible if I actually explained how I did it. Then others could reproduce it. I just figured if anyone cared, they would ask.

first see this link on how to get the steltek fighter:

http://vegastrike.sourceforge.net/forum ... php?t=6464

The steltek fighters takes longer because you have to aquire them one at a time instead of simply buying them at the commodity exchange. You have to launch with the paradigm, eject a ship, switch to it with '[', dock in the paradigm, trade it for the steltek fighter, launch as the fighter, switch back to the paradigm and tractor it in. Once the fighter is in the cargo hold you can buy it at the paradigm's ship dealer. Continue ejecting ships, docking, buying stelteks, launching, and tracktoring. It takes a while.

In either case you want your paradigm to be full of whatever ship you want. You also need a paradigm in the cargo hold. How can you do this? When the paradigm becomes available buy it first at the ship dealer, then go to the commodity exchange and buy it there.

Ok so now you have your paradigm with a paradigm inside and a bunch of fighters. Here's where it gets tricky. First, sell the paradigm from your cargo hold. Go to the ship dealer and buy it there. You will be able to do this because the one you have is not in your fleet. Now you have one to pilot and one in reserve in your fleet. Every paradigm will be a copy of the one in your fleet. In other words, the paradigm you just bought will be full of fighters.

No go to the commodity exchange and buy back the paradigm, you might need to sell off some random cargo. You should now have 3 paradigms. One active with one in it's cargo hold, and one sitting in "my fleet".

Now you launch. Eject a fighter, switch to it, land, and pay to transport your paradigm in 'my fleet' to the paradigm you landed on. Then buy another paradigm from the ship dealer. This way you always keep one in your fleet for the others to copy. Launch with that paradigm, eject a fighter and repeat. Once you have 5 or so paradigms flying around. Dump all their fighters. It takes a while to skip through all the ships you dump and it gets laggy if too many are on the screen, but it just looks cool.

If you had enough money, and patience, you could in theory do this forever and create a virtually unlimited fleet of ships. The only problem is that you can't keep them all because you can only land one of your many paradigms. Plus it is quite expensive to buy say 20 paradigms, but you can rack that kind of cash up pretty easily doing cargo missions with the paradigm.

I hope all of that made sense. I probably should have put that in the original post.
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Post by ijuin »

It has GOT to be a bug that you can fit a ship inside the hold of the same class of ship. All ships should take up more cargo space than the size of their own holds.
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Post by Spaceman Spiff »

Well it is.
In fact, at least IIRC, all ships which can be bought under the catagory Depreciated should have been taken out of the game. I remeber a thread, just can't find it right now, where some devs wonder why they are still in. Most of those ships, especially the paradigm are extremly buggy. This was the reason to take them out.
So, owning them wasn't meant to be in the first...
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Post by TBwaar »

I would like to see the devs fix the bugs rather than take the ships out. I would also rather be able to buy a non-milspec paradigm so i can have more upgrade options. It seems like milspec ships are the only ones that were supposed to be removed, all except the stiletto. I wonder why, or rather why not the stiletto?
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Post by Privateer Ferrius »

There goes PiArmada, then.

Bloody hell, making the ships unbuyable don't make the bug go away, just makes the bug affect only the computer. Sheer laziness if that's they're fix, ifn ye ask me.
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Post by Spaceman Spiff »

First guys, there was the famous IIRC, meaning... I don't know for sure.
Second: I wouldn't talk about lazyness if I was profiting from those lazy peoples work right now, mr. big shot... :twisted:
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Post by Privateer Ferrius »

TBwaar's the one using the exploit. I don't use the Paradigm, the paperthin sheilds annoy me.
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Post by TBwaar »

I agree with you spiff, we're all benefiting from the fine work done by the developers and I can't expect them to make everything perfect. I just state my opinions on the matter on what I would like to see. I understand it would take some time to fix all the ships and that there are other issues of higher importance that need to be delt with so for the time being it makes more sense to drop the ships until they can eventually be reintroduced. At the same time, if the bug is there, i'm going to have some fun with it. :wink:
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Post by Spaceman Spiff »

Privateer Ferrius wrote:TBwaar's the one using the exploit. I don't use the Paradigm, the paperthin sheilds annoy me.
But anyway, you play the game... ;)
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Post by Privateer Ferrius »

:P
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Post by micheal_andreas_stahl »

I did it! And no thanks to my wing men! they went off some where else and destroyed a whole bunch of Kilrathi and Confed ships! :evil: Took me ages though!
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