Would the vega-strike community welcome micto-transactions?

Need help testing contributed art or code or having trouble getting your newest additions into game compatible format? Confused by changes to data formats? Reading through source and wondering what the developers were thinking when they wrote something? Need "how-to" style guidance for messing with VS internals? This is probably the right forum.
Post Reply
mccorkle
Trader
Trader
Posts: 16
Joined: Tue Feb 17, 2009 4:32 pm

Would the vega-strike community welcome micto-transactions?

Post by mccorkle »

If I just happen to be working for a company that is building a micro-transaction API that will be free to use for anyone within their project, would the vega-strike community welcome a real world money market place being opened up within their game?

A typical use case of this system would be as follows:

People:
UserX - a Linux / Windows / Mac gamer with a small amount of money
ArtistY - a creative person or team (3d modeler, texture artist, musician, voice actor, etc) that has created new content for vega-strike
CompanyZ - a legal company in the US run by a 30 year game industry veteran

Case:
UserX downloads and plays vega-strike for free on his windows / linux / mac platform and enjoys it a lot. He continues to play it. At some point, he would like more content in the universe. ArtistY has been working on a whole new race for vega-strike, and he places it on a micro-transaction-capable market space for 1000 credits. UserX can browser the market and decide that he'd like to spend really money on a product there. He comes to CompanyZ's (who owns the micro-transaction backend) website and gives them $5 and receives 5000 credits in the micro-currency. He then spends 1000 credits on the content, it downloads into his game, and he is now able to enjoy the new content with very little trouble and very low cost.

Out of the 1000 credits ($1usd) that UserX spent on the content, the bulk (we haven't settled on a number yet, but > 50%) goes to ArtistY, and a small handling fee goes to CompanyZ. ArtistY can either make money directly by selling content in game, or the vega-strike development team can take art / music / AI / config / ETC donations and sell them to bring in money to pay for its hosting, etc costs.

New users like UserX are driven to the micro-transactions both by marketing done by CompanyZ, by the vega-strike community, and cross pollinated from all the other games that will also be using the micro-transaction API to sell inexpensive entertainment content to users.

-----
Are there any major challenges against integrating something like this into Vega-Strike? I see it as a great way to both bring new users into the community, raise awareness of this awesome project, and at the same time make a little money for the development team and content creators (which never hurt anyone). Vega-Strike itself (code and all) would stay 100% open source, and the only thing that would have to be closed is the server side where you call and ask for content (and spend real money) and a small module to decode the encrypted content package once it comes down (keeping the sold content where it can't be just torrented out to all your friends).

Any thoughts from the community?
loki1950
The Shepherd
Posts: 5841
Joined: Fri May 13, 2005 8:37 pm
Location: Ottawa
Contact:

Re: Would the vega-strike community welcome micto-transactions?

Post by loki1950 »

Are there any major challenges against integrating something like this into Vega-Strike?
Yeah is all this compatible with the GPL 2 as all of our content is compliant otherwise we have no distribution channel Linux side as most distros have strict policies regarding what goes into there repositories.

I will leave this up and i am inviting our community to comment on as i certainly don't make decisions on project direction :wink:

Enjoy the Choice :)
my box::HP Envy i5-6400 @2Q70GHzx4 8 Gb ram/1 Tb(Win10 64)/3 Tb Mint 19.2/GTX745 4Gb acer S243HL K222HQL
Q8200/Asus P5QDLX/8 Gb ram/WD 2Tb 2-500 G HD/GF GT640 2Gb Mint 17.3 64 bit Win 10 32 bit acer and Lenovo ideapad 320-15ARB Win 10/Mint 19.2
RedAdder
Bounty Hunter
Bounty Hunter
Posts: 149
Joined: Sat Jan 03, 2009 8:11 pm
Location: Germany, Munich
Contact:

Re: Would the vega-strike community welcome micto-transactions?

Post by RedAdder »

As I understand it the extra content would not come from the repository and would not enter it. Maybe hooks for it would enter it.

As to the legal barriers, any code added to the projects codebase to support microtransactions, and decryption must be under its license, which may be a problem with the requestor.

Maybe he could write it as a separate program. Even then there is also a potential problem with including just the data file in the VS version installed at the user, although the main party doing the mixing would be the user and as long as the user does not redistribute it, we would likely not care about it and it might be considered fair use.

Other projects use a different license for the content, or have exceptions for things like this, for example a compiler(e.g. gcc) allows you to use the binary on your terms even if the binary is relying on code produced by the compiler.

Also, if you do a total conversion mod, there is AFAIK a loophole in GPL2 which allows you to use a different license for parts that are kept separately from the main work, although you would still need a small license exception to eventually mix stuff - and also the requestor isn't asking about a total conversion.

Oh yes, and of course IANAL, just reading a lot.
MC707
Venturer
Venturer
Posts: 555
Joined: Sun Jan 18, 2009 5:18 am
Location: Quito, Ecuador.
Contact:

Re: Would the vega-strike community welcome micto-transactions?

Post by MC707 »

Hmm I personally don't find that idea suitable. No sir, not at all. This game is fine (awesome) as it is, and adding a feature so you gain money doesn't sound good. I don't know if I understood well, but what you are saying is that we pay real money to you and we get game credits? If thats the case, thumbs down. :| I wouldn't mind if artists gained money (they are working, I know), but there are some people that cannot pay with money but rather can support the project (me :P ). For the team, a little [donate] button would be fine (I guess).
My Machine: OS: Ubuntu 8.10 (intrepid) 64 bit in a 500GB Maxtor HD @ 7200 RPM, Windows Vista PsyChoses Edition 2009 32 bit in a 500GB Samsung HD @ 7200 RPM CPU: Intel(R) Core(TM)2 Quad CPU Q6600 @ 2.40GHz GPU: nVidia GeForce 9400 GT @ 1024 MB RAM: 3891 MB
Earthlings|The End of the Internet?|FreeWebsite
mccorkle
Trader
Trader
Posts: 16
Joined: Tue Feb 17, 2009 4:32 pm

Re: Would the vega-strike community welcome micto-transactions?

Post by mccorkle »

I'll reply to all the questions in chronological order:

As for the distribution system being compatible with GPL2, I am also not a lawyer, but I know that my Ubuntu distro comes with binary only (non-open source) wifi and graphics card drivers, so there is a way to distribute non-free code modules right along with open source things (like the linux kernel), so I'm sure we'll be able to legally find a way to do the small decode module (and all the decoded content) as a separate module.

I agree with what RedAdder was suggesting. Someone would build a stand alone "launcher" for vega-strike that would have the decode module and purchase methods all built in, and once it had purchased the content, it would launch vega-strike with the new content included. The launcher would be closed source, but it would not be a part of the open-source vega-strike package, hence no need for it to be GPL2 bound.

As for MC707's comment, I'm not at all even suggesting that we take anything away from Vegastrike or the community. What I am suggesting is to bring more artists, coders, voice actors, etc into the vega-strike community. A lot of professional creatives (and coders) don't have a lot of spare time, but if we were offering to pay them even a little something for their time, it might help them decide between doing an amazing set of textures for planet/globe surfaces -vs- just uploading another sketch to their myspace profile. Both take time for the artist to do, one helps the vegastrike community, the other just ends up being a digital image with a few hundred hits on myspace.

I'm also wanting to include people like the 3d / texture artists over at places like Daz3D.com -- just imagine if the same people selling their already high quality art over there spent the time to refactor their work into art we could use inside of Vegastrike, the amount of content (ships, stations, full 3d animated aliens, etc) would grow leaps and bounds -- BUT those artists are professionals and wouldn't even consider putting much, if any, time into a free venture, because they simply can't afford to.

Again, just my own $.02.
MC707
Venturer
Venturer
Posts: 555
Joined: Sun Jan 18, 2009 5:18 am
Location: Quito, Ecuador.
Contact:

Re: Would the vega-strike community welcome micto-transactions?

Post by MC707 »

mccorkle wrote:As for MC707's comment, I'm not at all even suggesting that we take anything away from Vegastrike or the community. What I am suggesting is to bring more artists, coders, voice actors, etc into the vega-strike community. A lot of professional creatives (and coders) don't have a lot of spare time, but if we were offering to pay them even a little something for their time, it might help them decide between doing an amazing set of textures for planet/globe surfaces -vs- just uploading another sketch to their myspace profile. Both take time for the artist to do, one helps the vegastrike community, the other just ends up being a digital image with a few hundred hits on myspace.

I'm also wanting to include people like the 3d / texture artists over at places like Daz3D.com -- just imagine if the same people selling their already high quality art over there spent the time to refactor their work into art we could use inside of Vegastrike, the amount of content (ships, stations, full 3d animated aliens, etc) would grow leaps and bounds -- BUT those artists are professionals and wouldn't even consider putting much, if any, time into a free venture, because they simply can't afford to.
1. Well, the fact that it could bring artists, coders, etc, sounds good, I admit.
2. OK, professionals coming to VS sounds good as well.
3. The current VS Team does have professionals - talented ones - which do give free venture. Some are very, very busy with their lives, but they still put their bit of sand grain to the project.

As I said, not everyone can buy credits in game. Now a question: are you offering a completely mandatory system of payment? Meaning, does everybody have to pay?
My Machine: OS: Ubuntu 8.10 (intrepid) 64 bit in a 500GB Maxtor HD @ 7200 RPM, Windows Vista PsyChoses Edition 2009 32 bit in a 500GB Samsung HD @ 7200 RPM CPU: Intel(R) Core(TM)2 Quad CPU Q6600 @ 2.40GHz GPU: nVidia GeForce 9400 GT @ 1024 MB RAM: 3891 MB
Earthlings|The End of the Internet?|FreeWebsite
RedAdder
Bounty Hunter
Bounty Hunter
Posts: 149
Joined: Sat Jan 03, 2009 8:11 pm
Location: Germany, Munich
Contact:

Re: Would the vega-strike community welcome micto-transactions?

Post by RedAdder »

There is a potential downside that I want to mention, that is that people who would have contributed to VS art will instead contribute to the marketplace established in the hope of getting a few dimes. Some of the art that I have seen so far is pretty good.
mccorkle
Trader
Trader
Posts: 16
Joined: Tue Feb 17, 2009 4:32 pm

Re: Would the vega-strike community welcome micto-transactions?

Post by mccorkle »

Yeah, the thought had crossed my mind that if we started paying some people for content, the existing content creators would start only creating paid for content. It wouldn't take away from the current stuff (that is free and should likely always be free), but I was hoping that by introducing some capitalism into the equation that we'd get more artists able to take more time on the project.

And in response to MC707, not everyone has to buy content to play and enjoy the game. I've played Cabal-Online (http://www.ogplanet.com/main.og) for months and never paid a dime (its not too bad for a free Korean MMO). I enjoy the game, even without spending money on the thing. But on the other side, I've probably put around $20 into Exteel upgrades and loved every minute of it. Again, both are MUCH cheaper (gameplay time to the dollar) than I'd spend if I was playing WOW, Eve Online, EQ, etc AND the companies (OG Planet and NCSoft respectively) still make plenty of money on their games.

So I'm not saying everyone has to pay money, just suggesting that people pay for premium content and the premium content creators (or the VS team) can make some money, which, in my experience, helps to push development along.
MC707
Venturer
Venturer
Posts: 555
Joined: Sun Jan 18, 2009 5:18 am
Location: Quito, Ecuador.
Contact:

Re: Would the vega-strike community welcome micto-transactions?

Post by MC707 »

Still, giving premium content to payers would be quite unfair for people who can't pay for it. Nevertheless, I see you had good intentions in mind. At first, I thought you wanted to make big bux, I see maybe I'm wrong. :D
My Machine: OS: Ubuntu 8.10 (intrepid) 64 bit in a 500GB Maxtor HD @ 7200 RPM, Windows Vista PsyChoses Edition 2009 32 bit in a 500GB Samsung HD @ 7200 RPM CPU: Intel(R) Core(TM)2 Quad CPU Q6600 @ 2.40GHz GPU: nVidia GeForce 9400 GT @ 1024 MB RAM: 3891 MB
Earthlings|The End of the Internet?|FreeWebsite
mccorkle
Trader
Trader
Posts: 16
Joined: Tue Feb 17, 2009 4:32 pm

Re: Would the vega-strike community welcome micto-transactions?

Post by mccorkle »

haha, I have been writing code on and off since I was 12, and I've yet to make big bucks off of it. I'm only offering because I *might* be working for a company that is building an micro-transaction API that they want to let indi developers use within their projects for free. They plan to make their money when people actually use the API, but they only make money if the indi developer makes money. Though I *might* currently a 1099 at a company like that, I don't own the company, and if it makes big bucks, they won't be my big bucks.

My only goal here is to see if some work that I've been working very hard at can be used to benefit a really cool project like VS. If not, I'll find other ways to contribute.
MC707
Venturer
Venturer
Posts: 555
Joined: Sun Jan 18, 2009 5:18 am
Location: Quito, Ecuador.
Contact:

Re: Would the vega-strike community welcome micto-transactions?

Post by MC707 »

mccorkle wrote:My only goal here is to see if some work that I've been working very hard at can be used to benefit a really cool project like VS. If not, I'll find other ways to contribute.
That sounds beautiful. I might cry (seriously) :cry: Now I hope you come here to stay, we need all the help we can get :D
My Machine: OS: Ubuntu 8.10 (intrepid) 64 bit in a 500GB Maxtor HD @ 7200 RPM, Windows Vista PsyChoses Edition 2009 32 bit in a 500GB Samsung HD @ 7200 RPM CPU: Intel(R) Core(TM)2 Quad CPU Q6600 @ 2.40GHz GPU: nVidia GeForce 9400 GT @ 1024 MB RAM: 3891 MB
Earthlings|The End of the Internet?|FreeWebsite
mccorkle
Trader
Trader
Posts: 16
Joined: Tue Feb 17, 2009 4:32 pm

Re: Would the vega-strike community welcome micto-transactions?

Post by mccorkle »

MC707 wrote:That sounds beautiful. I might cry (seriously) :cry: Now I hope you come here to stay, we need all the help we can get :D
I could write it into haiku

the projects are few
that I can give some good to
know that this is one

Not my best, but its 1:15am here, so I will have to leave it at that. :wink:
Fendorin
Elite Venturer
Elite Venturer
Posts: 725
Joined: Mon Feb 26, 2007 6:01 pm
Location: France, Paris

Re: Would the vega-strike community welcome micto-transactions?

Post by Fendorin »

it's remind me a song of ABBA : money money money.....money money money ....
thanks to give me the song in me head ....money money money .....tulult ltutltlututut .... :roll:
loki1950
The Shepherd
Posts: 5841
Joined: Fri May 13, 2005 8:37 pm
Location: Ottawa
Contact:

Re: Would the vega-strike community welcome micto-transactions?

Post by loki1950 »

What we call an earworm :lol: The only cure an other song that is powerful enough too replace it :wink:

Enjoy the Choice :)
my box::HP Envy i5-6400 @2Q70GHzx4 8 Gb ram/1 Tb(Win10 64)/3 Tb Mint 19.2/GTX745 4Gb acer S243HL K222HQL
Q8200/Asus P5QDLX/8 Gb ram/WD 2Tb 2-500 G HD/GF GT640 2Gb Mint 17.3 64 bit Win 10 32 bit acer and Lenovo ideapad 320-15ARB Win 10/Mint 19.2
Fendorin
Elite Venturer
Elite Venturer
Posts: 725
Joined: Mon Feb 26, 2007 6:01 pm
Location: France, Paris

Re: Would the vega-strike community welcome micto-transactions?

Post by Fendorin »

Like "Matcho ..matcho man....!!!!) from vilage people...?? yes is working but is ugly


Matcho .....Matcho Man... tu tu tlutututu t...........
Turbo
ISO Party Member
ISO Party Member
Posts: 423
Joined: Mon Jun 11, 2007 11:54 am
Location: TX, USA
Contact:

Re: Would the vega-strike community welcome micto-transactions?

Post by Turbo »

Turbo

There are two speeds in combat: stopped, and as fast as you can go. Unless you run into something, going fast keeps you alive more often than stopping.
Fendorin
Elite Venturer
Elite Venturer
Posts: 725
Joined: Mon Feb 26, 2007 6:01 pm
Location: France, Paris

Re: Would the vega-strike community welcome micto-transactions?

Post by Fendorin »

well is terrible.....
cerewa
Explorer
Explorer
Posts: 14
Joined: Sat Sep 03, 2005 2:31 pm

Re: Would the vega-strike community welcome micto-transactions?

Post by cerewa »

I've noticed that progress is slow on vega strike. Which is fine ...

Here's a thought I have on the "micro transactions" idea that would make it SUPPORT the development of open content rather than be an ALTERNATIVE to open content:

get the content developers to set a "money-earned" goal, and agree that the content will be licensed under GPL or Creative Commons after the goal is reached.

So, maybe a project I spent a lot of hours on, I want to be paid $500 for it. We could have an agreement where people who play the game can have the content for $5 each, and when the $500 goal is reached, the content becomes open content and can be added to the free game.
EatMyDst
Explorer
Explorer
Posts: 15
Joined: Fri Feb 04, 2011 1:00 am

Re: Would the vega-strike community welcome micto-transactions?

Post by EatMyDst »

I think that adding expensive (not like really expensive just that it costs actual money) premium content to the game would take away from the original free-ness. Thats one of the great things about VS, is that its free and I think adding real money upgrades would take away from that.
strook
ISO Party Member
ISO Party Member
Posts: 461
Joined: Fri Sep 03, 2010 12:10 pm

Re: Would the vega-strike community welcome micto-transactio

Post by strook »

i would accept micro transactions on vegaogre as shown in the link below :D

vegastrike does it , too, by the donation mechanism of sourceforge.
plz visit my vegastrike project branch here

plz support VegaOgre by donating to it!

My systems: Mac mini 1, 4gig RAM;
i5 Quad Core 2400, 300mbit WLAN, 1,3Tbyte HD, 60 GB SSD,
nvidia geforce 8400gs 512MB, 6gig RAM with Ubuntu 11.4,
win7 and hackintosh installed
Post Reply