Fleet Selection

Post your best tactics and strategies for getting the big bux in Vega Strike
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Captain{}Blood
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Fleet Selection

Post by Captain{}Blood »

Anyone have a suggestion for three ships to keep in in your fleet for well balance capabilities. Trading would be good and then there are the combat considerations.
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Re: Fleet Selection

Post by Fendorin »

the "Franklin" is the best for multi purpose mission= speedy, some cargo space, good mount point
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Re: Fleet Selection

Post by loki1950 »

Well the Llama has to stay you can't sell it :wink: so that's one slot filled it makes a not bad trader for small speciality cargo's just max out the upgrades so it survives pirate encounters.For large cargo's you have three main choices in size order Clyde ,Ox or Mule so which one can you tolerate flying :wink: Now the fun ship your pirate blaster here is where the choice is very personal.

Enjoy the Choice :)
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Re: Fleet Selection

Post by -REBEL3- »

For fighting things like Uln, I've found the Nicander to be effective. I've got mine loaded with 4 disrupter cannons. For bigger game, the Goddard is very nice. *NOTE*- I deducted a few million credits, and gave mine a pair of the blue Rlaan turrets (can't remember the name right now.) The default rets are OK, but I recommend upgrading them.
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Re: Fleet Selection

Post by w03 »

For combat, the rlaan taizong is one of my favorites. It has 2 light/medium/heavy mounts, 2 light mounts, and a special-missile mount. The light/medium/heavy mounts can fit rlaan Ktek beams (3780 mjs/sec damage) that really tear through pirates and uln fighters. The taizong can also fit two grav thumpers in the light mounts to take care of capships (one or two shots obliterates a gleaner, and 5 shots + a little blasting from your ktek beams kills a yeoman). The special missile mount can hold a third grav thumper or any special missile you like. The only two disadvantages are the rather mediocre acceleration (this is somewhat mitigated by the high maneuverability) and the fact that for some reason, the taizong accumulates damage rather quickly despite its high hull resistance. The taizong has enough cargo room to do some good trading if you buy cargo space upgrades.

For a cargo ship, either the franklin (if you have a money to burn) or the pacifier (or both). The franklin is probably the best ship for hauling low mass, high value cargo such as AI cores. The franklin has less cargo room and lighter weapon mounts but is much more maneuverable. The pacifier is good if you need more cargo space or if the area around is swarmed by enemy vessels, due to its fairly large amount of cargo room and weapon mounts (4 x light/medium/heavy, 2 x light, 2 x special missile, 2 x heavy missile, 2 x light missile/medium missile).
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Re: Fleet Selection

Post by -REBEL3- »

w03 wrote:For combat, the rlaan taizong is one of my favorites. It has 2 light/medium/heavy mounts, 2 light mounts, and a special-missile mount. The light/medium/heavy mounts can fit rlaan Ktek beams (3780 mjs/sec damage) that really tear through pirates and uln fighters. The taizong can also fit two grav thumpers in the light mounts to take care of capships (one or two shots obliterates a gleaner, and 5 shots + a little blasting from your ktek beams kills a yeoman). The special missile mount can hold a third grav thumper or any special missile you like.
Only one problem with that loadout-the Ktek beams eat all your energy and have short range, while the Grav Thumpers are slow to refire, and hard to find ammo for. If you can deal with those problems, it's a good ship.
w03 wrote:For a cargo ship, either the franklin (if you have a money to burn) or the pacifier (or both). The franklin is probably the best ship for hauling low mass, high value cargo such as AI cores. The franklin has less cargo room and lighter weapon mounts but is much more maneuverable. The pacifier is good if you need more cargo space or if the area around is swarmed by enemy vessels, due to its fairly large amount of cargo room and weapon mounts (4 x light/medium/heavy, 2 x light, 2 x special missile, 2 x heavy missile, 2 x light missile/medium missile).
Problem with the Pacifier is that it is a bit slow to turn, so hitting enemies is a bit of a problem. I like ships with turrets because the turrets can deal with enemies nicely.
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Re: Fleet Selection

Post by w03 »

-REBEL3- wrote: Only one problem with that loadout-the Ktek beams eat all your energy and have short range, while the Grav Thumpers are slow to refire, and hard to find ammo for. If you can deal with those problems, it's a good ship.
The Ktek beam actually has a fairly decent range; in VS 0.5.0, the range is listed as 7,515 meters, which is greater than quite a few other fighter weapons.

I agree that Ktek beams eat up enormous amounts of energy (10,000 mjs/sec is a lot!). However, the Taizong can fit in a fairly large reactor and capacitor. With a size 12 reactor + a size 10 capacitor, a Taizong can sustain 3 gravthumpers and 2 Ktek beams for ~11.5 seconds. Considering the high damage output (3,780 mjs/sec per ktek beam), even a few seconds of sustained fire is more than enough to destroy anything smaller than a corvette. (Longer, sustained fire can kill corvettes and subcaps such as gleaners).

Concerning the gravthumpers, I believed they were the best use for light and special-missile mounts as they provided defense against corvettes or subcapital ships (they are meant to be a torpedo replacement). Gravthumpers are short ranged and a bit difficult to aim (though I think they are easier to aim than missiles), but completely bypass pd turrets, unlike missiles. In general, gravthumpers seem more versatile than their torpedo replacements.

Coincidentally, gravthumpers can be used to kill vessels that are about to crash into and kill you.

If the taizong is too specialized, than the Zhuangzong or Nicander are good choices as well.
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Re: Fleet Selection

Post by Cockroach »

Trader: Llama
Fighter: Dostoevsky
Fun/Patrol: Progeny or Schroedinger

Llama
Pros: Good size cargo hold, should be able to handle 3 cargo missions at once with more to spare. Fairly agile for a freighter when the hold is empty and is able to defend itself.
Cons: It handles like a brick when you fill it with massive cargo. The holds are large enough to get it well over 10x stock mass.

Dostoevsky
Pros: Fast and agile. It has 2 heavy gun mounts and 1 heavy missile mount, meaning it can carry a torpedo. Nice Mule/Thales hunter.
Cons: The missile mount only can carry 1 torpedo.

Progeny
Pros: Fast and extremely agile. Can stay on anything's tail in the hands of a skilled pilot. 2 medium guns and a crapload of missiles.
Cons: The medium guns can have trouble bringing down shields for the missles to finish the job.

Schroedinger
Pros: It's quick and fairly agile.
Cons: It only has 1 light gun mount. This can be seen as a pro in a way however since it tends to make you more cautious about getting into fights you can't handle. I tend to treat it as an unarmed craft when I'm flying around and I don't think I've ever lost one like I have with numerous Progenys in the same circumstances.
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Re: Fleet Selection

Post by Drak Zelthor »

I've only just started playing however I've found that a pacifier works well enough for all purposes. Its cargo hold is large enough for the purposes that I use it for (trading mining and electronics equipment) and it is strong enough to allow me to survive the pirate, Uln, Forsaken, LHW, Confederation and anyone else that may happen to be shooting at me.
The number of weapons mounts that this ship has are its real high light. With Four heavy, two light and then 2 heavy missiles (each able to mount 2 torps), 2 medium missiles, and two special missile mounts.

It may not be the fastest ship out there and the slow manoeuvring makes it a pain to fight some types of fighter (Nicanders or whatever there called). However I have found that with four microwave lasers it is not too big a problem as It only takes a few seconds to roast most fighters.

So definitely good to trade with in less than friendly territory and a decent combat vessel for those who want more fire power/defence less speed/manoeuvrability.
landyS3
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Re: Fleet Selection

Post by landyS3 »

I find that the Dostoevsky makes an awesome killing machine...
2#Jackhammer with auto-tracking (from any Commerce Center)
Friend-or-Foe missiles
PolyDuranium armour
Capacitor VI
ECM III
Jump drive
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Reactor VI
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SPEC capacitor
Quad Shield X
That uses up all the upgrade space, but what a killer it makes. You can easily take out hoardes of pirates or luddites without hardly scratching your armour. And as for cargo...

THIS MAY BE A BIT OF A CHEAT, BUT IT WORKS

Buy a big clunker cargo vessel - something like a Mule for example.
Strip it down and sell all its bits (you won't need any of them).
Fly your Dostoevsky off to where you want to buy things (Pirates and Luddites usually know better than to tangle with you).
When you get there, buy your Mule (doesn't cost anything in-system).
Fill it up completely with all that lovely cargo.
Buy your Dosto back and fly it (empty) to wherever you want to sell your Mule cargo.
When you get there, buy your Mule back (costs nothing in-system, but about 50000 between systems - a small price to pay compared to all the profit you're going to make).
IT ARRIVES COMPLETE WITH ALL ITS CARGO - no slow journey getting constantly attacked.
Sell all your cargo.
Buy your Dosto back (free) and go around again.

This way you can have a huge cargo hauler for trading (but without all the problems of slow journeys and constant threats etc.) plus a superb killing machine for all those lovely bounty missions etc. And it all costs much less than you think (as they say).

Just the two does all.
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Re: Fleet Selection

Post by klauss »

LOL - you're hiring a truck driver ;)

Granted, that it's free in-system may be a bit of an exploit...
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Re: Fleet Selection

Post by Rattan »

That it is totally free in system is something I think should maybe be fixed. In-system transport fee should be considerably less than between systems, obviously. But logically, somebody is getting paid to deliver your ship, and there'd be docking fees, etc. We can assume because it always gets there in one piece that those pilots are very good and avoid all fights. But it might make more sense if that fee was maybe something like 1/10th or so of what it costs to have your ship(s) brought to you from out of system?

"The best 3 ships" is going to depend a lot on how you're playing at the moment.

If you're making money via trade routes, then you need a biggie like at least a Mule. You find a route with at least several stops and at each stop you buy everything that's at a good price and sell anything that you can get a decent profit off of. Not really practical with smaller ships, but with bigger ships it's a fairly fast track to a good amount of credits in your account. When that route starts to "go dry" (or you get bored with it), you switch to either a scout or a fighter and go exploring to find a new route. Go back to the old route some other time. The only big hauler I've owned is the Mule, so I can't really say which of them is the best. Mule does pretty good though.

For exploring/scouting, it depends on what you like doing. If you prefer to avoid fights, something small and very fast. A Shizu or a Schrodinger are my choices. If you like a good dogfight, then a Dostoevsky or a Franklin are nice.

For big battles, I like the Pacifier. It's a little heavy, but it can take and deliver quite a pounding when it's decked out.

As to the starter Llama, it's not a bad little multipurpose ship. But as has already been mentioned, you can't sell it off anyway, so it'd end up being one of your three. LOL But for a 3 ship fleet including the Llama, I'd just add the heavy hauler of your choice and something like a Pacifier for any fights you think might be too big to handle in a Llama.
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Re: Fleet Selection

Post by landyS3 »

Yes, I agree, it is a bit of a "cheat" and a loophole that could do with fixing. I used this "facility" for loading up a Mule with all available cargo then journeying around everywhere to see what the prices were, i.e. building up a comprehensive price list. (Maybe even this is a bit of a fiddle as well :wink: ). I won't use it when actually playing, because that just seems like too much of a fiddle really.

I think that the "ship transport" facility should only be made available for empty ships, i.e. if they have no cargo at all. If they contain any cargo, then you should be forced to actually fly it, then you have to do a bit more thinking about what you really want to carry versus the problems in getting it there in one piece. The problem I find with the Mule (in particular, but possibly also with the Plowshare) is that the turrets are very weak and poor for defending against attacks, and there doesn't seem to be much available locally to replace them. It would be better if some decent beam weapons or guns were reasonably available for them. Even with the flight computer disconnected it's virtually impossible to spin the big lump around to get a lock with a missile. I'd have thought that in this mode the inertia would be markedly reduced, but it doesn't seem to be.

To transport an empty ship, maybe 5000-10000 in-system, and 10000-25000 between systems? This would be more or less in line with the remuneration for typical bounty missions (which are about the same risk factor).

It's possible to sell the Llama, but there's no point since you seem to actually lose money by selling it!
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Re: Fleet Selection

Post by Rattan »

I would disagree on the point of only allowing "ship transport" for unloaded ships. If we go by the logic that what the player is actually doing is hiring a skilled and cautious pilot, then it's not unreasonable to expect that the ship would contain cargo. In fact, other than perhaps for a small fighter or scout, it would be rather silly if such transport was available to not make some commercial use of it.

It is unlikely that the owner of a fleet of ships would be leaving them all in dock somewhere if the option exists to "hire a driver" to bring them in safe and sound.

To make it a more reasonable part of gameplay, perhaps it could take some game time for the transport to occur in. The player wouldn't need to sit through it, I suppose, the game could just inform them that a few days or weeks have passed. The option to insure the ship and cargo might be offered. Another option would be to do some missions or whatever during that time so the player is literally "waiting for their ship to come in." There could also be some slight chance of the ship being lost in transit to pirates or accident. It might even be possible that the owner/player would have to do a rescue mission to save their own ship once in a great while. Those could add some interesting depth to the game if we can consider the possibility of turning what some perhaps view as a "cheat" into a more developed facet of gameplay.

Considering that the big ships would actually be unlikely to be operated by a single pilot under most circumstances, I don't find it unrealistic that the owner of a fleet would pay to have the ship "delivered" safely to port by a professional skipper and crew. It would be more realistic if it cost a bit less to transport smaller classes of ships than the larger ones, and heavily loaded ships would probably cost a bit more to transport than empty ones, simply because they move slower. How much everything should cost, well, that'd be a matter for some discussion. It shouldn't be so much as to make the procedure unprofitable or only marginally profitable. There should be advantages to owning a diverse fleet, considering the substantial investment involved.
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Re: Fleet Selection

Post by klauss »

Rattan wrote:I would disagree on the point of only allowing "ship transport" for unloaded ships. If we go by the logic that what the player is actually doing is hiring a skilled and cautious pilot, then it's not unreasonable to expect that the ship would contain cargo. In fact, other than perhaps for a small fighter or scout, it would be rather silly if such transport was available to not make some commercial use of it.

It is unlikely that the owner of a fleet of ships would be leaving them all in dock somewhere if the option exists to "hire a driver" to bring them in safe and sound.

To make it a more reasonable part of gameplay, perhaps it could take some game time for the transport to occur in. The player wouldn't need to sit through it, I suppose, the game could just inform them that a few days or weeks have passed. The option to insure the ship and cargo might be offered. Another option would be to do some missions or whatever during that time so the player is literally "waiting for their ship to come in." There could also be some slight chance of the ship being lost in transit to pirates or accident. It might even be possible that the owner/player would have to do a rescue mission to save their own ship once in a great while. Those could add some interesting depth to the game if we can consider the possibility of turning what some perhaps view as a "cheat" into a more developed facet of gameplay.
I totally agree.

However, it's a LOT of work to do right.

But I totally agree.
Rattan wrote:Considering that the big ships would actually be unlikely to be operated by a single pilot under most circumstances, I don't find it unrealistic that the owner of a fleet would pay to have the ship "delivered" safely to port by a professional skipper and crew. It would be more realistic if it cost a bit less to transport smaller classes of ships than the larger ones, and heavily loaded ships would probably cost a bit more to transport than empty ones, simply because they move slower. How much everything should cost, well, that'd be a matter for some discussion. It shouldn't be so much as to make the procedure unprofitable or only marginally profitable. There should be advantages to owning a diverse fleet, considering the substantial investment involved.
Also agree here, and this part is much easier to implement (assuming there's a clear way to compute said cost)
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Re: Fleet Selection

Post by Rattan »

Having thought about it, I'd say insurance should probably be a separate issue. It could be a good addition, something where you can buy it like you by basic fuel and maintenance. But it maybe should also be available for the ship you're currently flying. It could encourage players to actually eject in emergencies if they had purchased insurance, rather than just going back to a saved game.

Logically, the price for delivering your ship to you (loaded or not) would be based on what it would cost in fuel to get the ship to you plus some percentage that would represent the pay for the pilot or crew. But if the ship isn't right in the next system or something, that calculation could get complex since the game would need to figure out the number of jumps and etc. As a more reasonable compromise, how about just the gross tonnage of the ship times some "constant". The "constant" would be basically whatever number or fraction it takes to multiply by the weight/mass of a fully loaded Mule (or whatever ship is decided on as the base example) to get 50K (or whatever the present rate for a transfer actually is). That way a small empty ship would cost less. Maybe put a lower limit on it like "if transportcost <=5000 then transportcost =5000" so it can't go below maybe 1/10th of the current price being charged in the game for a transfer, not even if what your getting delivered is a hang-glider flown in from next door. ;)

It wouldn't be perfect, but it could feel like it makes sense at least to a degree, since full ships would cost more than empty ships. If the ship is in the same system as the player, make the cost much smaller, like maybe 1/20 of the "interstellar" cost, but still not entirely free.

Any time a loaded ship with any reasonable cargo capacity is getting moved, it would almost certainly make a lot more profit than what I've given as an example here.
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Re: Fleet Selection

Post by klauss »

Actually, I'm thinking a fully loaded mule would cost way more to transport than 50k.

As said, it would involve a lot of expenses. Fuel not the least of which, but also payment to a full crew compliment (which begs the question whether you need such a crew when flying it yourself), insurance (which should be mandatory when hiring someone, like it is in RL in many countries), a commission for the hiring agency (you're not supposed to contact prospective drivers yourself, but instead through an agency perhaps), etc, etc...

So perhaps the transport cost should be a nonlinear function of the value of its cargo (commission) plus a formula like you mention considering tonnage (fuel expenses), plus some other formula considering the dangers involved (insurance).

Computing the path from system to system isn't a big deal. It's computer science 101. Or 102. Still, basic stuff.
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Re: Fleet Selection

Post by Rattan »

Yeah, I almost said "Plowshare" instead of "Mule", but I figured a loaded Mule might be more acceptable as a ship to base the rate on for the people that fly Clydesdales or who hack *just* so they can fly the even bigger capships that aren't normally available to the player at any price.

As a minor sidenote, I think that eventually it would be good if there was no such things as ships that are not available to the player. The price might be astronomical, maybe only available in one or two systems and then only if you're at very friendly relations with certain factions, but they should be *possible* for the player to own. It's more realistically the way things would work. I'm not entirely sure, but I think in this world, if you or I wanted to own, oh, say the Queen Elizabeth 2 cruise ship.. It'd be possible if we had enough money and made the right friends. To simply make it unavailable is an "easy out" way of trying to balance a game, and is more appropriate to the early days of space games than it is to Vega Strike. LOL But that's a side point, and I'll leave it at that.

I think you have a great line of thought going as to the ship transport costs, Klauss. I'm not sure as I agree on the point of the cargo's value being a large point of the calculation. Do people who work on freighters hauling computers across the Pacific get paid more than the ones working on freighters hauling bananas? I really don't know on that matter. LOL But definitely the distance and mass are going to amount to fuel and paying for the hired crew's time and work. The player is the entrepreneur, not the hired crew. So I would think that the benefits for choosing *good* cargo should be to the player's profit. The hired crew is working a job, the business doesn't belong to them.

The current cost being anything near a "base cost" should only be true if the ship being delivered is a reasonable number of jumps away. For example, to have a loaded Mule delivered from Atlantis to the Earth's Moon should be so expensive that it would actually be cheaper to buy and fully equip and load a brand new Mule. Unless the player had been buying and stockpiling things like AI cores and autofacs for quite a while, it should just be too expensive to be profitable to have a ship delivered over a distance like that. It's ships being moved, not some miraculous transporter technology (which, if it existed and was actually that cheap would make owning and running ships obsolete, anyway).

Where the good money should be possible is getting ships delivered in system or to systems one or two jumps away. Then it would be something which would be a practical choice for players to reduce the play time of piloting slow ships themselves when finding and working good trade routes. Or a way to get your favourite war-wagon(s) brought in when a situation is discovered where the player may feel it would be actually worth what it costs to have some or all of the fleet flown in.

What I think might be ideal in the long run would be if the player could carry most of their fleet in their Clydesdale or whatever. Then they could use a scout or light fighter to explore a system or few ahead and pay to have their capship brought up after they've determined if a system is safe enough (or profitable enough), or alternatively if it has enough fighting and bounties to make having more of their fleet present worthwhile.
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Re: Fleet Selection

Post by Psyco Diver 69 »

Honestly I like the Llama is good all around ship, fully loaded can handly most things except military ships, I did trade missions till I upped mine enought to do clean sweep missions and bountys for pirates, luddites and uln. I like my Franklin though, when I go to do a clean sweep or bounty a few systems away it allows me to haul some cargo to the same system to bring in a little extra cash. I load up on the highest phase damage weapons, right now I have rapid micro wave beam guns which deal 500 phase damage and the turret is just plain nice. Progeny is fun a ship too and is excellent for fighting, so is the Acient, thats alot of fun to dog fight with
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Re: Fleet Selection

Post by Gungnir »

My favorite two ships are a Goddard, loaded with Shield Breakers, Torps, and IRs; and a Tesla, stock. The Goddard is incredibly expensive, though, and all those upgrades boost the price significantly. Also, you have to hack the Tesla...
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Re: Fleet Selection

Post by marX »

I have the Goddard for trading Ai cores and the Lancelot for taking out the fighters and other small crafts. I didn't like the handling of Goddard so I'm looking for a powerful ship with better handling !!!
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Re: Fleet Selection

Post by Benison »

first up, i DID sell my llama(dunno if its been impossible in the past, but works fine now), wich is a great starter ship(even tho 900k is a bit much imho), but really not remarkably good at certain roles.

as for now i mainly use:
cargo: mule -> barely able to move, but still waaaaay faster than an ox. huge upgrade and cargo capacity but poor armament, but you surely dont buy theese things to fight in em. never seen a clyde for sale yet (only found plenty of oxes on ice and trantor planis so far), but if it moves at a speed similar to an ox, i wouldnt really consider using one(more like a trophy you keep).

multi: adomisher -> very sturdy, nice weapon loadout including torps, and enough cargo room for ai cores/wetware to earn some cash fast and LOTS of upgrade space. really havent found anything that lets you break a sweat when sitting in one of those.

fighter: gawain -> nowhere near as agile as a "real" fighter, and just 2 missiles are a bad joke really, but nearly thrice as fast(combatspeed) as an adomisher and alot more agile then lets say a vendetta. allso lvl12 shields make me feel ALOT more comfortable compared to something a single ff missile could pop.

i might add that i have some serious fuel problems using the gawain, and couldnt figure out how fuel consumption is determinated.
can anyone provide me some info on how this works?
do "oversized" capaciators cause increased fuel consumption or anything like that?
after 4 jumps max i have to head to a base to refill, when fighting large numbers of enemies i sometimes even run dry on fuel before i can clear the way to the next port.
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Re: Fleet Selection

Post by greenTTY »

I am playing 0.5.0 stable version. I downloaded it so long ago but (for some reasons) never been able to play until recently. I decided to explore the game a bit more before wasting my bandwidth to get the newer one. I am curious about how many Shady Mechanics are available for purchase out there? Because, so far I just found the Overpowered Turning Jets. I am a big fan of Andolian made vessels, thinking of getting Kierkegaard class starship as my second ship. Do you think it is avalaible for purchase?
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Re: Fleet Selection

Post by Deus Siddis »

greenTTY wrote:I am playing 0.5.0 stable version.
...
I am a big fan of Andolian made vessels, thinking of getting Kierkegaard class starship as my second ship. Do you think it is avalaible for purchase?
It is, but only in the versions newer than what you are playing.

Unfortunately, even in the latest version you cannot purchase replacement ammunition for its primary weapons, but I believe I fixed that issue for the next release (0.5.2) which should be out relatively soon.
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