need some help rewrite armor

[Motorb1tch]

hi all!

this is what i want to do:

at the moment, a "plaststeel armor" will have a mass of 10, no matter in whitch ship u build it in.
i think a plaststeel armor of a interceptor shuld have a different mass than a plaststeel armor for a capship.
the sulution wuld be: instead of giving a fixed mass in the units.csv there shuld be a value like: " +10% shipmass"
same with repairdroids, du to the different shipsizes there simply cant be a "one-size-fits-all" upgrade for this funktion.
any know how to implement this?
didnt get it on my own.

thanks

mb

[klauss]

It could be done, but I don't think it's such a good idea after all... armor usually is one-size fits all, since it's usually composed of "pluggable" panels (take "pluggable" with a bowl of salt).

But, that distinction seems quite a good idea.

So... I suggest using an already-exiting functionality which makes somewhat more sense to me: forbidden upgrades.

See the list of forbidden upgrades in units.csv? Well... just make a few classes of armor: capship, heavy, medium, light, etc... and make it so that only matching classes can mount them. Perhaps with some leniency:

Categories:

• upgrades/armor/heavy
• upgrades/armor/capship
• upgrades/armor/medium
• upgrades/armor/light

A possible "foribdden upgrades" entry for a medium ship would be:
"upgrades/armor/capship upgrades/armor/medium upgrades/armor/light"

EDIT: It's "prohibited upgrades".

[Motorb1tch]

----armor usually is one-size fits all, since it's usually composed of "pluggable" panels ----

sure... i tought so too, but the ammount of plates u need to fit out a ship depends on the ships hullsize. as there are no 2 ships with the same mass or eaven size, this wuld be verry inaccurate.


----See the list of forbidden upgrades in units.csv? Well... just make a few classes of armor: capship, heavy, medium, light, etc... ----

i had the same idea, but i droped it.
the reasons: way to complicated.
need at last 3 or 4 times the code in master_part_list and units.csv. for every single armour type (now 6 , so if we do it the way u suggest like 16 new lines)
plus the stuff in the "prohibited" column. (this column will be verry crowded without making amor, repairdroids and stuff like that the way u suggested)


just change the type of value "mass" to a percentual value depending on shipsize for these items wuld be easyer (no changes needed exept col. 20&21 in units.csv, but no single new line) and WAY more accurate and realistic.

[klauss]

Not more accurate. Mass would depend on the surface to cover (which isn't even the entire surface of the ship), not its volume (and a ship's mass depends largely on its volume).

What you say can be done, I think, but I'm not sure how. I think that if you add mult_ to its name, it achieves this effect (but for both, mass and armor). A proper implementation could be interesting, though.

[Motorb1tch]

---Mass would depend on the surface to cover, not its volume ---

true. but i think it wuld be just "good enugh" if the armor mass depends on shipmass. shuld be easy to add another column with defines shipsize, but as this is not needed to any other i think it wuld be ok to go with shipmass.


--I think that if you add mult_ to its name, it achieves this effect --

dont understand that.
u mean if i call armor01 just mult_armor01 it wuld have a mass that depends on the mass of the ship it is to build in?


---What you say can be done, I think, but I'm not sure how---


but do u know who can do this? i think it wuld worth the efford.
not only for armor, other upgrades (like trusterenhanchements, repairdroids etc.) wuld benefit from this too.

[klauss]

--I think that if you add mult_ to its name, it achieves this effect --

dont understand that.
u mean if i call armor01 just mult_armor01 it wuld have a mass that depends on the mass of the ship it is to build in?

Pretty much, yes.
But it would also have an armor value that depends on the ship's armor value.

---What you say can be done, I think, but I'm not sure how---


but do u know who can do this? i think it wuld worth the efford.
not only for armor, other upgrades (like trusterenhanchements, repairdroids etc.) wuld benefit from this too.

What I'm saying is... I'm just not sure adding "mult_" is enough. Somebody does, for sure... just wait for a reply on this.
But... if we were to implement exactly what you say (which, BTW, isn't that hard, and it could end up being pretty elegant - I'm thinking about this), I could do it pretty easily. I'm just taking my time to think it trhough before doing it.

[Motorb1tch]

---...also have an armor value that depends on the ship's armor value---
bah! na that sucks

--- I'm just taking my time to think it trhough before doing it.---

thats exactly what i wanted to read.
THANK YOU!

didnt wanted to rush u with that

[jackS]

currently there are 3 types of upgrades, currently distinguishable by the prefix of their name. These are replacement, additive, and multiplicative upgrades, with (null), add_ and mult_ prefixes respectively. Replacement changes existing values to the new values specified, add adds them, and mult multiplies them. There aren't any types that can add one field and multiply another at present.

[Motorb1tch]

hmm...
wuld it be difficult to reprogramm the engine that way, that the first definition says what to do with the values of an item in generaly but have the option to say in a row that this single value has be treated else?

like row6 "Upgrade_Replacement" and in row 20/21 something like "mul 1.2" or "*1.2"

i cant code anything on my own and have absulutely no clue how much work this means and how difficult it wuld be.

[klauss]

Yeah, I'm thinking something along the lines.

Code: Select all

12  (replacement)
12+ (addition)
12- (subtraction)
12* (multiplication)
12% (multiplication by 0.12)
12/ (division)

[Motorb1tch]

it would also have an armor value that depends on the ship's armor value.

bah! na that sucks

tought again on this.
maby i was wrong and this dont suck but acctualy culd be a good solution...
atm armour gives a fixed amount of armorvalue regardless of the ship it is build in.
this is making the start armour value pretty indifferent, it barely has an inpakt on gameplay.
this makes balancing the ships more difficoult.
maby it wuld not be the most sientific way to simulate amour, but better for game play.

[JonathanD]

Price should probably be a moving target too... and a few other things

armor for a capship ehh... it shouldn't cost the same as the same armor upgrade for a small fighter. The capship tends to need at least a little bit more

another thing, on turrets and drawing from the main reactor (This has been discussed before). If this is implemented, maybe the values in the csv for the turrets "reactor" should stay, and represent the turrets ability to pull energy from the main ship reactor, and their own, small scale storage of said energy.

sooooo........ (taken from priv units.csv)
Primary_Capacitor Reactor_Recharge
100 10

Would mean the turret can store 100 units, and can pull from the main reactor 10, instead of self-charging.

This would serve 2 purposes... keep energy usage down and controllable on large ships, and give huge ships an excuse to have the massive reactors that to me, would be cool.

Just a few thoughts.