new Paradigm command bridge

masteroforion · Post by **masteroforion** » Mon Jun 20, 2005 8:33 pm

Here is the new "command chair perspective" bridge for the Paradigm.
http://vegastrike.sourceforge.net/galle ... t/paradigm
Could not upload the screenshot, therefore posted it in the user-submitted art gallery...
Side and rear view will follow soon...

Tested it in the WCU Paradigm, noticed some things:
- The bridge seems to be located somewhere inside the ship, with the rest of the ship invisible. Is there a way to put it on top of the ship, with view alongside the hull?
- what are those strange large turrets shooting red laser bolts or so?
- I would give the Paradigm a Capship Missile Launcher instead of the Antimatter Cannon as an anti-capship weapon, it is supposed to be among confed's most advanced destroyers, and to destroy the enemy from far away seems more advanced to me than the 4 Antimatter Cannons of its predecessor (?), the Gilgamesh.

Post by **mkruer** » Mon Jun 20, 2005 10:07 pm

Did you create the bridge of the Paradigm? If so I like it, but I would like to make some critical comments. You donâ€™t have to listen.

It looks a little star trekish.
Second what is with all the chairs? That was the one thing I have never under stood in the entire WC ship is their super huge, throne room like bridges?

Realistically I can see five full time positions on the bridge.

Communications Officer
Weapons Officer
Pilot
Co-pilot
Captain

These to me are the five minimal people required for a â€œfullyâ€

masteroforion · Post by **masteroforion** » Tue Jun 21, 2005 12:18 am

Yes I created the bridge, using Blender (no clue how to post a 3D model in some viable format though), but so far only the elements towards the front are there.

It looks star-trekish, i have to admit...
I did another bridge before:
http://www.crius.net/zone/showthread.php?t=18220
with exactly 5 stations all together, but it just didn't feel like the bridge of an advanced destroyer (it would better fit some older ships like the Exeter or a transport), and there was the call for a more star-trek or star-wars like bridge, so I wanted to find out how that would look.

Post by **hurleybird** » Tue Jun 21, 2005 12:34 am

I like th color scheme of your orininal model (in the WCU thread) but it lacks the bridge-like feeling the new one has. Really good work on both though, thats awesome!

Post by **mkruer** » Tue Jun 21, 2005 12:40 am

Well I have always been a fan of the huge, behemothic, Brobdingnagian, bulky, colossal, cyclopean, enormous, gargantuan, gigantic, immeasurable, immense, jumbo, king-size, leviathan, mammoth, massive, mighty, monster, oversize, titanic, towering, vast, Ship, wit an itty-bitty bridge.

As for the 3d model, the 2d images are fine, its just that I looks a little to â€œfinishedâ€

masteroforion · Post by **masteroforion** » Tue Jun 21, 2005 1:33 am

there it is:
http://vegastrike.sourceforge.net/galle ... gm_bridge3

spiritplumber · Post by **spiritplumber** » Tue Jun 21, 2005 2:17 am

that be beautiful, arrr.

Post by **mkruer** » Tue Jun 21, 2005 2:34 am

I like the original better, it just flows better

Post by **MamiyaOtaru** » Tue Jun 21, 2005 3:25 am

It isn't possible to see your own ship from the cockpit ATM. For an example workaround: see the rear cockpit view of the centurion. The engines were added later by taking a shot of the centurion from the correct angle. They are thus unfortunately static, but when the rest of the cockpit st as well, it doesn't look so bad. Something similar could be done with the Paradigm, as soon as it is determined where the bridge actually is. Right now, it is near the back on the bulge rising up in the center (best guess).

I rather like the layout. The struts seem too flat somehow, the Paradigm is very rounded. Certainly passable though.

Post by **klauss** » Tue Jun 21, 2005 6:58 pm

An easy workaround for seeing one's ship is to chop it down and use it as a 3-D cockpit, off-center. So, in addition to the 2D sprite that is the ship's true cockpit, the 3-D cockpit renders the ship itself. Get it?

Post by **MamiyaOtaru** » Tue Jun 21, 2005 10:38 pm

True. Now that we can do 3d cockpits without having to sort the faces that would actually be feasible. Think I'll give it a shot.

edit
works just fine (of course) and with the cockpit set in the right place in units.csv, all the bolts and turret fire appear to come from the right spots.

Now, it can be combined with a 2d image, or since you appear to be making yours in 3d, it can simply all be 3d. It.d look pretty sweet actually, being able to see the nose of your ship off in the distance out that window.

Post by **klauss** » Wed Jun 22, 2005 2:07 pm

I wrote:An easy workaround for seeing one's ship is to chop it down and use it as a 3-D cockpit, off-center. So, in addition to the 2D sprite that is the ship's true cockpit, the 3-D cockpit renders the ship itself. Get it?

It came to my attention that the above phrase could sound rude. Sorry, if it gave that impression, it was never my intention to be rude. I just spent a lot of time trying to phrase it, trying to put my thought into words, and got annoyed by my inability to do so, and took the short path: write it as well as I could, and hope you got the idea. Which, gladly, it seems you did.

Post by **chuck_starchaser** » Wed Jun 22, 2005 3:42 pm

That was me, regarding the expression "Get it?". Klauss's English is so good I figured probably most people wouldn't realize he writes in his second language, and might be taken aback..

masteroforion · Post by **masteroforion** » Thu Jun 23, 2005 10:20 pm

http://vegastrike.sourceforge.net/galle ... gm_bridge4

A new version of the bridge, on which I tried to incorporate some of the suggestions made here...

question: Is there an easier way to put the sprites to where they should be, but to repeatedly edit the .cpt file and start the game over and over again?
another question: how can I add a 3D cockpit?

Post by **klauss** » Thu Jun 23, 2005 10:25 pm

question: Is there an easier way to put the sprites to where they should be, but to repeatedly edit the .cpt file and start the game over and over again?

I don't think so.
But I read somewhere in the forum (check the tools forum) about a preview tool that can avoid the "repeatedly" attribute.

WOW! Big improvement. Mostly lighting. That's real good.

smbarbour · Post by **smbarbour** » Thu Jun 23, 2005 11:54 pm

I had started to work a little on a program to do just that using Visual Basic. I had the scaling of boxes using the values used by the cpt format working. If I ever have free time, I'll work on it.

Post by **MamiyaOtaru** » Fri Jun 24, 2005 6:49 am

masteroforion wrote:http://vegastrike.sourceforge.net/galle ... gm_bridge4 A new version of the bridge, on which I tried to incorporate some of the suggestions made here...

Very nice looking indeed!

question: Is there an easier way to put the sprites to where they should be, but to repeatedly edit the .cpt file and start the game over and over again?

Yep

Quick answer: You can reload the cockpit after editing the .cpt without restarting the game. Hit f1 a couple times and it loads the new .cpt. Longer answer: the position of all the sprites is controlled by a pretty simple equation, which when you know it can be used to place them in the right spot on your first try. I incorporated it into a spreadsheet: I just enter the wished for x and y coordinates and height and width for each component and it spits out the values needed. It was done in kspread, not sure if I can successfully export it to an Excel readable format..

So, explanation follows. The screen is divided up into four cartesian quadrants. right hand of the screen is positive x, left hand is negative x. Top is positive y, bottom is negative y. Screen ranges from -1 to 1. To put something in the middle of the upper right quadrant then, its coordinates would be .5,.5.

The height and width is given as a percentage of a quadrant. In other words, something that takes up the whole screen is 2,2. Something that takes up a fourth of the screen has width and height .5

Assuming that on a 1024x768 screen, your sprite should be 256 pixels wide, the value you use for width is 256 / (1024/2).

Plugging this stuff in to your calculator takes the guesswork out of placing instruments.

another question: how can I add a 3D cockpit?

See some of the cockpits in vanilla vegastrike. You need to convert to a VS usable form (xmesh or bfxm, probably .obj as well) and specify it in your .cpt. Unfortunately you can't place instruments in 3d right now, you'd have to position them in such a way that they looked like they were in the right place in the 3d space (and this would only work if the 3d cockpit didn't move, which requires some config variables)

If I get some time I could help out with any or all of these steps, I'd love to see this in game. If you like, mail what you have (preferably as .obj) to privater at gmail d0t com.

spreadsheet attached, anyone using kspread can poke around in it. (rename to cockpit.ksp)

masteroforion · Post by **masteroforion** » Thu Jun 30, 2005 11:43 pm

Just sent the final (?) version of the bridge to the privater address and posted some screenshots in the user-submitted-art-gallery: http://vegastrike.sourceforge.net/galle ... reenshot11
http://vegastrike.sourceforge.net/galle ... reenshot12
http://vegastrike.sourceforge.net/galle ... reenshot13
http://vegastrike.sourceforge.net/galle ... reenshot14

Post by **mkruer** » Thu Jun 30, 2005 11:57 pm

@masteroforion

I donâ€™t often say this, so this IS something coming from me, and Iâ€™m not trying to suck up ... well maybe i am. Anyway, excellent job, I can live with this. My only minor suggestion is to ditch the rear view in favor of a more realistic, (can not see anything behind you) view. Perhaps, if we can implement it, the rear view will become I giant tactical Map exclusive to only capital ships. This would allow for people to deploy fighter escorts, and what not. I am very impressed with what you have so far. Keep up the good work, and I hope to see it implement soon.

P.S> I call dibs on the Hades Class Quick Strike Carrier Bridge, I have Mockup that I might post in the future.

charlieg · Post by **charlieg** » Fri Jul 01, 2005 1:38 am

masteroforion, that's truly excellent.

I wonder what BradMick would make of it. He (and John Cordell) seems to be the authority on WC cockpits.

masteroforion · Post by **masteroforion** » Fri Jul 01, 2005 1:00 pm

mkruer wrote: ditch the rear view in favor of a more realistic, (can not see anything behind you) view.

I wanted the bridge to be placed somewhere atop the ship (maybe more to the front then it is now), with a 3D-cockpit part simulating the ship itself. It's not realistic in the sense that the bridge should be at some well protected spot in the ship, but it would make a great view seeing both the ships nose to the front and the rest across its hull to the rear. It is practical as well, since the paradigm is not that maneuverable (actually the famous flying brick should do better), so if you want to see what is behind you, using the back view is better then turning the ship...

A working tactical map or a main status display (like on the Excelsior-Class in Star-Trek) would be useful, too. Just to put a picture there without any function is somewhat boring, in my view.

spiritplumber · Post by **spiritplumber** » Fri Jul 01, 2005 1:51 pm

The way I have it in my (cheap!) drayman cockpit is, i have a "screen" in the back view which gives a back view. It needs some cleaning up as it does look like a hole in the picture, but you get my point.... make a rear viewing "display" and set that to transparent.

or leave it as it is, it looks great!

charlieg · Post by **charlieg** » Thu Jul 07, 2005 1:16 pm

Is this going in then? Or is there still work to be done?

What about damaged versions of the various components?

spiritplumber · Post by **spiritplumber** » Thu Jul 07, 2005 2:09 pm

sure! if not for the paradigm, for a custom capship the player may get in the plot.

BradMick · Post by **BradMick** » Thu Jul 07, 2005 4:19 pm

eh, its not bad design/layout wise. needs more detail, and the textures need some serious help. otherwise, yeah...its not bad.

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new Paradigm command bridge

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